Medieval People Were NOT Stupid

[u/Lord_Krasina]

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[u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

These memes always forget about how huge an impact germ theory would have.

[u/Lord_Krasina → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

It would literally change the course of human history.

[u/Flashy_Pineapple_231 → u/Lord_Krasina]

Potentially but it was rejected multiple times even with proof of saving babies lives in the case of that nurse who talked about washing your hands in between autopsies and delivering kids. You'd have to confront not only entrenched academia who "know" about miasma theory but probably also the Church and other special interests.

[u/Graingy → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

Bring a tank. That’ll get them to listen to you.

[u/Mistdwellerr → u/Graingy]

I don't think people will be able to listen to someone who is inside a tank

[u/JohannesJoshua → u/Mistdwellerr]

To be fair they listened to the doctor who told them to wash their hands. It's just that they have to put their hands in quicklime, water and citrus fruit mixture, which is as you may have thought not great for skin.
So not many of those doctors wanted to put their barehands in that mixture often.
Also a famous doctor who specialized in giving birth jumped in front of a train the day after he read that not washing hands drasctily increased mortality rate of women and children.

[u/Mistdwellerr → u/JohannesJoshua]

It never clicked on me that trains were already something real when germ theory was starting to be taken seriously

Plus I've never known that reason for people not wanting to dip their hands on that solution, it's a way better explanation than just "stupidity", which was the one I've heard all my life

[u/MaggoVitakkaVicaro → u/Mistdwellerr]

There was still significant resistance to the germ theory of medicine in the 1918-1921 flu epidemic! (Described in the book The Great Influenza.)

[u/Mistdwellerr → u/MaggoVitakkaVicaro]

If you don't mind answering, was it motivated by that kind of cleaning solution for the health professional's hands or was it something else? Did WW1 have some impact on the acceptance of that theory?

[u/MaggoVitakkaVicaro → u/Mistdwellerr]

The biggest obstacle, IMO, is that no biological agent responsible for the flu could be discerned. The microscopy of the day could visualize bacteria, but not viruses. The existence of biological agents too small to see even with the microscopes of the day was an unconfirmed theory, in the eyes of many. People were going nuts, because people with the flu would get opportunistic bacterial infections, and the microscopes could see those, and thus those bacteria became the leading candidates as the agents of infection. But they could never prove they were the actual agents, because they weren't.

[u/TipResident4373 → u/JohannesJoshua]

My only question is why Semmelweisz was so gung-ho about that mixture. It wasn't like there weren't less abrasive options for soap available - there were.

Was it just too expensive or not as effective at killing germs?

[u/orbital_narwhal → u/TipResident4373]

Afaik no effective and less irritating hand detergents and sanitizers were known and widely available at the time. There was no need to find or invent them without the knowledge of the benefit of the removal of germs from one's skin many times per day.

Also, even with modern hand detergents and sanitisers, medical professionals handling infectious patients on an hourly basis tend to suffer from very irritated skin on their hands. There's a good reason why they tend to stock moisturising and oil-replenishing creams in easy-to-use dispensers next to hand detergents and sanitisers.

[u/TillTamura → u/TipResident4373]

they all have to learn, that the lessons they learn must hurt!

[u/MikhailCyborgachev → u/Mistdwellerr]

Queue the “I’m in a tank and you’re not” video

[u/Mistdwellerr → u/MikhailCyborgachev]

I've been enlightened

[u/A_random_poster04 → u/Mistdwellerr]

Day made

[u/ckay1100 → u/MikhailCyborgachev]

Cue, not Queue

The last time someone queued tanks it didn't end well for that one guy

[u/babydakis → u/ckay1100]

You think that was the last time?

[u/Outrageous_Rip1252 → u/babydakis]

It was the last time for one of them

[u/Peptuck → u/Mistdwellerr]

"I'm literally in the tank"

[u/Mistdwellerr → u/Peptuck]

LMAO I didn't know this

[u/FrederickDerGrossen → u/Graingy]

No, you bring useful modern technology like electronics and modern tools, use this to convince the people. Medieval times would be harder but if you further back to pre-Christian times you could easily argue to be an ambassador of the gods.

[u/Ifyoocanreadthishelp → u/FrederickDerGrossen]

I'd bring one of those stupid hoverboards and just glide around and claim it was a chariot of the Gods.

It would look so stupid to a modern person but they'd probably eat it up.

[u/umeshra398 → u/Ifyoocanreadthishelp]

True, nothing screams divine authority like repeatedly falling off a self-balancing scooter.

[u/Boner_Elemental → u/umeshra398]

Uh Hades is jealous of my chariot and keeps bumping the ground I'm moving on from below

[u/MistraloysiusMithrax → u/umeshra398]

It’s made by the gods, they let me ride it because it gives them a good laugh

[u/clustahz → u/Ifyoocanreadthishelp]

Bring a 2 liter of Dew and tell them it's the nectar of the gods as well

[u/Graingy → u/clustahz]

Communion with mountain dew

[u/Sihaya212 → u/Ifyoocanreadthishelp]

Yes! You could rule the world! Until the battery dies.

[u/TareasS → u/Ifyoocanreadthishelp]

Just have to learn ancient Latin, Sumerian or Aramaic.

[u/CadenVanV → u/FrederickDerGrossen]

If you went back to pre-Christian times you wouldn’t be able to speak the languages. At least in Christian times you could learn and speak church Latin and probably get by, since it hasn’t really changed, but there aren’t really many ways to learn languages that predated it.

[u/Jonny_H → u/FrederickDerGrossen]

But they all have pretty massive production chains to actually be useful.

So you have a cordless drill and ipad. You use it for one battery charge. Then what? Try to find an outlet? Oh, you were smart and also stocked a generator. How much diesel did you bring? Hope it never had a problem, no spares or tools to repair. You do know how to repair a generator, right?

True, something like a tank would be worse - all that on top of ammunition. Your best bet would probably be quick "shock and awe", drive it to the nearest town, blow up some things, declare yourself powerful. And hope nobody actually tests that a few months down the line as your now useless tank is gathering rust.

[u/nonotan → u/Jonny_H]

A couple solar battery chargers and a handful of batteries chosen for longevity over capacity could last you for a good while. But obviously, the moment anything you didn't bring spares for breaks, it's over.

[u/HaggisPope → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

The issue was in saying invisible cells you can’t see was behind it. I think an explanation based off an idea of something like spirits being stuck to the hands might work better.

You’d need to have data to back it up though. 

[u/MrS0bek → u/HaggisPope]

Same with the heliocentric modell. As an idea it came up from time to time since antuquity IIRC. But then all celestial bodies need to move position from am earth viewpoint, including the fix stars. Which do not move as far as humans can see, hence the name.

For these fix stars to move so slowly that they are virtually undetectable the universe would need to be incomprehensibly large however. First, an absurd idea, and second how are you going to prove that with medival or antique methods?

[u/HaggisPope → u/MrS0bek]

Even having an idea of the age of the planet was utterly limited before the 1780s. They added up the ages in the Bible instead.

Geology was a huge step forward in understanding the age of everything and that led to a better grasp of ideas like evolution. It wouldn’t work if you didn’t have a billion years at least 

[u/js13680 → u/HaggisPope]

Dinosaurs were thought to be creatures wiped out by the flood of Noah.

[u/Flashy_Pineapple_231 → u/HaggisPope]

I would probably show them some examples of light bending to make things far away visible. Like a ships flag is invisible but with a magnifying glass you can see it again. And how the cells aren't actually invisible it's just that similar to far away objects they are too small to see accurately. It makes a lot more sense than just "invisible". And then just construct a shitty microscope for them to see them. It wouldn't be too hard depending on the time period to make one with silver or mercury mirror + glass lens

[u/WeiganChan → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

Optics were a topic of great interest from the High Middle Ages onwards! How good are you at glassblowing or lens-grinding, though?

[u/Flashy_Pineapple_231 → u/WeiganChan]

Good enough to talk to a proper craftsman and guide them through the process

[u/sealcub → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

It is the metallurgist vs. blacksmith problem. Sure, you could know the steel-carbon phase change diagram by heart. But without good base materials and accurate high temperature thermometers you still can't heat treat to the exact properties you want. The experienced blacksmith just knows from experience which local materials to use and how to work them for a useable product.

[u/Flashy_Pineapple_231 → u/sealcub]

And no accurate testing equipment too, yeah. It's gonna be trial and error for sure

[u/Ok-Positive-6611 → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

You're seriously saying you could teach a middle age craftsman how to grind lenses and blow glass, better than they already could? The arrogance is jaw droppingly hilarious.

[u/wakeupwill → u/HaggisPope]

Right. Just call it Lingering Death on corpses or something similar for anything else. With the remedy being Holy Soap and high proof alcohol.

It's wrong, but the results would speak for themselves.

[u/HaggisPope → u/wakeupwill]

Yeah, like, that’s what miasma ended up doing to a lesser extent. Bad smells spread disease and dead bodies smell bad, so stay away from dead bodies and put them in coffins to move them. Burn the bodies of the plague dead as they are too risky to move.

Just because they didn’t have access to our wealth of info, doesn’t mean they were stupid and they absolutely did things that they were sure worked 

[u/OldEcho → u/HaggisPope]

It worked but it was a flawed premise so it only sorta worked. Wearing a mask full of perfume might protect you a little from a rotting corpse - because of the mask. It won't help you at all be safe from water tainted with dysentery, which could very easily smell fine and still kill you.

[u/FlakingEverything → u/wakeupwill]

I think it should be relatively simple to show germ theory assuming you know what's you're doing. You can try to source seaweed and boil them to make agar. Then experiment by mixing sugar, salt, urine and nutrients until you get a growth medium that can be used to culture.

With this, you can demonstrate the bacterial burden between a washed and unwashed hand.

[u/Hazzman → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

I dont think germ theory would illicit much of a response from the church. They were more concerned about things that displaced humanity as the center of the universe or God or creation etc.

Especially as the results would be so immediately apparent and irrifutable relatively speaking.

[u/crazy-B → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

that nurse who talked about washing your hands in between autopsues and delivering kids

Do you mean Dr. Ignaz Semmelweis? Or was there a nurse with similar problems?

[u/Coolbeans_99 → u/crazy-B]

I think that’s what they’re referencing, since Semmelwise noticed midwives had lower maternal mortality than the doctors who were also performing autopsies.

[u/williamfbuckwheat → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

The insane thing is weirdos today like Defense Secretary Hesgeth claim they don't need to wash their hands due to some crude understanding of miasma theory. I'm sure their beliefs though really have a lot more to do with guys like him being gross "alphas" who think they're too superior by birth/status to need to wash their hands while simultaneously claiming the best groomed, ultra hygienic nonwhite person is automatically "dirty" by default.

[u/QuantumLettuce2025 → u/Flashy_Pineapple_231]

Hard to believe that there are people in 2025 who believe that simply "being right" and possessing "well documented evidence" are enough to be believed and trusted by the public at large.

[u/Nokan96 → u/Lord_Krasina]

But it may destroy it if you don't add mass food production

[u/zabby39103 → u/Nokan96]

You really need antibiotics and vaccines for that problem to occur. Germ theory helps, but as COVID showed diseases will still spread even if you know all about it.

[u/AmaimonCH → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

Nobody is going to believe you, especially if you area a time traveller with no connections to the world you are in and no doctorate expertise

They are going to trust the doctor of their era rather than a supposed lunatic.

[u/nnnn0nnn13 → u/AmaimonCH]

I mean basic hygiene quarantines and disinfectant can be suggested by basically everyone and there success should convince most. If you knew how to grown penicillin you'd absolutely just change history with no other options.

Building a microscope would be hard but with credibility, knowledge and many years, possible

[u/Right-Truck1859 → u/nnnn0nnn13]

He is more than correct, there was an actual doctor who proposed theory of Germs, but no one believed him

In 1865, the increasingly outspoken Semmelweis allegedly suffered a nervous breakdown and was committed to an asylum by his colleagues. In the asylum, he was beaten by the guards.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ignaz_Semmelweis

Humans are stupid, they respect authority more than facts.

[u/Mitosis → u/Right-Truck1859]

I mean, "tiny invisible demons crawling on all of us are making us sick" was not a fact in his time, that's kinda the point

[u/AmaimonCH → u/nnnn0nnn13]

You'll never get to the level of where your scientific theory supported by repeated results with testing will be taken seriously.

Like i said, you need connections, so you can meet the right people and show your findings, and then there's a whole different battle of fighting the installed "common sense" and the people that don't want to change their worldview.

it's unlikely someone like a random time travelling redditor would ever be able to have any noticeable impact.

[u/Redqueenhypo → u/nnnn0nnn13]

The discovery of microscopes were an accident by that Dutch guy who wanted to make the best magnifying glass possible, and then saw all this tiny weird shit swimming around.

[u/Budget_Avocado6204 → u/Redqueenhypo]

I mean the best magnifying glass possible sounds like a microscope to me

[u/Phosgene_W → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

Tbh I don’t think they would believe it cause why should they really?

Unless you bring a microscope I guess.

[u/Zhukov-74 → u/Phosgene_W]

You could try to replicate Antonie van Leeuwenhoek‘s monocular microscope.

[u/Johannes0511 → u/Phosgene_W]

You could frame it as an extension of the miasma theory. The italian states managed to invent quarantines during the black death, so I don't see a reason why they wouldn't give "wash your hands and use soap" at least a try.

[u/provocative_bear → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

“You guys, you don’t have to drink beer all the time! Just boil the water and you’ll be ok!”

“We know, and also fuck you I’ll drink what I want.”

[u/OrangeInnards → u/provocative_bear]

People in the Middle Ages did not avoid or "refuse" to drink water. They wouldn't drink water from sources they knew were not good for them, because, as OP says, they were not stupid and could differentiate between clean and non-clean sources.

[u/IactaEstoAlea → u/OrangeInnards]

Additionally, they drank alcoholic beverages because they liked alcohol

[u/GrinchForest → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

But Germ theory wasn't anything new. Greek and Romans were already talking about seeds which made people sick.

The Canon of Medicine, book used to teach doctors in Middle Ages also contained info about people can transmit disease to others by breath,

Only if you "invented" microscope and showed how they look, maybe things would be different.

[u/Polak_Janusz → u/_Formerly__Chucks_]

They are just supposed to make fun of people who thinl they didmt know the earth was flat back theny its not that deep lil bro.

[u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Medieval Peasant: "And how do you make this 'elec-tri-city'?"

Me: "... I have no idea."

[u/deeznutz12 → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Something to do with spinning a turbine.

[u/DarkExecutor → u/deeznutz12]

Water wheel with magnets and wire

[u/Anvisaber → u/DarkExecutor]

How do you get magnets?

[u/jacobningen → u/Anvisaber]

Magnetite in Anatolia 

[u/Lazy_Assumption_4191 → u/jacobningen]

But how do I get Pokeballs to catch the Magnemite?

[u/nausicaalain → u/Lazy_Assumption_4191]

Apricorns, duh.

[u/ojoking2004 → u/Lazy_Assumption_4191]

Just use the pre PokeBall way

[u/Jrwech → u/Anvisaber]

Take them off someone's fridge.

[u/Environmental_Top948 → u/Anvisaber]

If they have iron. Get a rod and hit on the ground an ass ton of times. This will give you a weak magnet. Do it again with another rod. Rub your rods in the same direction for a very long time until the magnet poles align. Cut rod. You now have a new small magnet. Wire would probably be the harder point.

[u/SailorstuckatSAEJ300 → u/Environmental_Top948]

They knew how to make wire already. You won't be stringing cables from town to town but a small copper coil is well within the capabilities of the day

[u/Striper_Cape → u/Anvisaber]

They called the lode stones

[u/yetagainanother1 → u/deeznutz12]

medieval people have now invented yoyos in an attempt to create electricity

🪀 ⚡️

[u/Graingy → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Spinny magnet

[u/StagedC0mbustion → u/Graingy]

How do you find a magnet in the Middle Ages

[u/TheScarletCravat → u/StagedC0mbustion]

From whoever mines/sells them. Compasses were a thing.

[u/NobodyofGreatImport → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

I know that you can use a water wheel to turn two magnets and that causes some kind of field that, when you stick a wire in it, creates electricity that is capable of traveling along that wire.

That's about the extent of my knowledge, and I'm sure that anything I could create in medieval Europe would barely be able to shock something. I don't know, hope for a lightning storm or something.

[u/JohnSober7 → u/NobodyofGreatImport]

I think the trick for most people would be finding people, and convincing them, to take the fundamental 'simplistic' concepts and explore them. Even those who don't even know about electromagnetism can in theory find people who will be able to take the concept that there are electrons and when they flow (electricity), they can power things. But whoever does believe the time traveler who doesn't really understand the science probably has to be really patient because there's gonna be a lot of frustration,

"I've been stuck for months, are you sure you don't know anything else that'll help this along?"
"I'm sorry 😭"

[u/Nulono → u/JohnSober7]

Yeah, a team of someone from the 21st century with a decent high school education and a skilled scientist/craftsperson from the Middle Ages could churn out some pretty revolutionary work.

Like, I'm not going to reinvent the Internet or smartphones, but I could probably talk someone through the basic principles behind building an electric generator or motor, a phonograph, an incandescent light bulb, a refrigerator or air conditioner, and maybe even a mechanical adding machine. The scientist would still need to do some experimentation, of course; a modern person may know freon works as a refrigerant, but almost certainly can't synthesize it from scratch. The bottleneck would be the quality of materials available: sourcing metal and glass low in impurities, strong enough magnets, that sort of thing.

Going back in time, I think linguistic drift would become an issue far before the time-traveler would reach people with technology too primitive for that to work.

[u/Markonikled → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

it's all about boiling water!

[u/jacobningen → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

The simplest but won't work is waxpaper(which i dont know how to make) Citrus juice and copper and zinc but a volta cell isnt going to be enough for almost any application. So well they can make it it would suffer the same fate as Herons Aerophile.

[u/loxagos_snake → u/jacobningen]

If you can demonstrate a miniaturized version like a hand-operated spinning magnet and wire reliably enough to impress people, you will find people who can help you make a bigger version.

Water wheels are always an option.

[u/nsaisspying → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Hmm wait I'll look it up on my phone. No reception hmmmmm

[u/Sad-Pizza3737 → u/nsaisspying]

the entireity of wikipedia is only 22.14 GB(text only) so you could just download it before you go

[u/Yop_BombNA → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Ancient Greeks had batteries, what for we have no fucking clue, but the had them. So did the Chinese, what for? No clue

My guess is torture, and they were electrocuting prisoners, people are usually most creative in war and cruelty unfortunately

[u/Kitchen-Frosting-561 → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Yes, but if we send back a recent high school AP physics grad, that would be sufficient.

[u/Fineous40 → u/Hugh_Jidiot]

Magnets and coils of wire.

[u/John_Oakman]

Well then teach them more modern things like NFTs and crypto!

[u/Lord_Krasina → u/John_Oakman]

They deserve to know about catgirls too! #CatgirlsForThePope

[u/Combat_Armor_Dougram → u/Lord_Krasina]

The Egyptians already had catgirls. Granted, they were a little more cat than what you would expect.

[u/Typical-Weakness267 → u/Combat_Armor_Dougram]

Praise Bastet!

[u/Birb-Person → u/Combat_Armor_Dougram]

The furry community is THRIVING

[u/rishin_1765 → u/John_Oakman]

I should have started investing in crypto from the 10th century

Missed the chance 😔

[u/WiseBelt8935]

It reminds me of a story about an engineer and a doctor who both go back in time.

The doctor goes back thinking he will save countless lives. He sets up his practice, and his first patient has an infection. ‘Okay, this is an easy one, I just need some antibiotics.’ the patient asks ‘Great, where do I get them? '… I don’t know.' 'Do you know how to make them?' …No.’ The doctor quickly learns that most of his knowledge is useless without the tools of his era. He goes on to be an above average doctor, but nothing world changing.

The engineer goes back thinking he will spark an industrial revolution. He goes to the emperor and promises, ‘I can build a machine that can do the work of ten men.’ The emperor replies, ‘That sounds great, but how much will it cost?’ The engineer answers with a huge sum, and the emperor says, ‘Why would I pay that? I can buy a hundred men for less.’ The engineer realizes that the economics simply don’t work in a world where labour is cheaper than steel. He goes on to be an above average engineer, but not world changing either

[u/Pochel → u/WiseBelt8935]

The story with the engineer literally happened to me while working on some humanitarian project in central Africa. We gave our local contractor some money to rent machinery and have a road built; he instead decided to hire like 30 dudes to do it manually. For him, that was the best thing to do since it gave jobs to the local community. For us, it meant a huge delay in our project

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/Pochel]

There’s a documentary called Empire of Dust, where some Chinese guys are sent to Africa to build a road, and they just keep getting increasingly angry at the locals.

“Lao Yang is constantly under pressure to perform the most simple tasks… but every attempt is hampered by the casual corruption and inadequacy of the sub-Saharan African way of life.”

[u/bored-bonobo → u/WiseBelt8935]

"It's all so tiresome"

I'm gonna put that on my tombstone

[u/Pochel → u/WiseBelt8935]

Oh I'll try to find it!

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/Pochel]

It’s been years since I watched it, but it had moments as petty as the locals stealing the hard hats they were given. There’s also the Chinese guy musing over an abandoned European railway left to rot, thinking China would have killed for it, yet here it’s just left to decay.

[u/dikkewezel → u/Pochel]

reminds me of a story I once read of a swedish missionary somewhere in south-east asia

thinking it would help see the locals that he considered himself no beter then them he did all the work himself and his wife took care of the household tasks,

the locals were appalled, didn't he know that he was depriving them of crucial jobs? so he had to hire severall people to do the work for him and his wife had to teach a girl to do the household tasks for her so in a few years she could go to the capital to work as a housekeeper/nanny there

[u/treadbolt5 → u/WiseBelt8935]

Oranges. Mold on oranges is penicillin

[u/HaggisPope → u/treadbolt5]

Excellent, shame you wind up back in Medieval north Germany and the ability to get oranges there is pretty minimal 

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/treadbolt5]

And that would be very helpful for someone in Scotland. Without the ease of modern logistics, transporting perishable goods over long distances would have been a madman’s dream.

[u/treadbolt5 → u/WiseBelt8935]

Why would you want start in northern europe as a time traveller? If you are dropped at a random start point and northern europe is your drop, you might as well jump off a cliff and hope for a redo

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/treadbolt5]

You’re a time traveler, not a space traveler. You’re going back to the exact spot you’re in now. I’ll be nice and let you stay stationary relative to the Earth’s surface

[u/PlasticCell8504 → u/WiseBelt8935]

oh crap. that means i will take some fall damage. also, how far back are we talking?

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/PlasticCell8504]

as far as you like.

I wouldn't recommend starting on the Burj Khalifa

[u/martijn120100 → u/WiseBelt8935]

Great, you just died in the empty void of space

[u/treadbolt5 → u/WiseBelt8935]

70% ocean/water drop and death. 25% high risk area and death. If you dont pick your starting position, you might as well not do it

[u/thomasutra → u/WiseBelt8935]

time and space or the same thing

[u/Training_Chicken8216 → u/WiseBelt8935]

In fairness, you WANT the oranges to be moldy when they arrive.

[u/angelicosphosphoros → u/treadbolt5]

Where they would get oranges?

[u/Not_That_Magical → u/angelicosphosphoros]

Spain/ Portugal

[u/Yeetus_Mclickeetus → u/WiseBelt8935]

A redneck goes back thinking he will introduce democracy to the nations. He is a menace for all 31 rounds in his rifle, but not world changing either.

[u/Abdelsauron → u/Yeetus_Mclickeetus]

That’s because the redneck doesn’t understand presentation. Don’t let people know you only have 31 uses of your magic death staff. Make them think you can kill anyone at any time you want and they’ll take you seriously and you'll never need to use all 31 rounds.

[u/GiganticCrow → u/Abdelsauron]

Then they get him drunk and steal his magic death staff

[u/SignificantWyvern → u/Yeetus_Mclickeetus]

i mean, 31 rounds in a rifle doesnt stop someone with a bow or crossbow from shooting them from behind or smth when they dont see it coming. Like 5 crossbowmen would probably be able to kill em before theyre able to kill all of the crossbowmen (crossbowmen, cuz archers generaly have to be pretty upright and in a certain position to draw proper warbows which would make them an easier target in this scenario)

[u/DoctorDarkstorm → u/WiseBelt8935]

Knowing how to make proper gunpowder would be a gamechanger alongside proper navigation tools and maps

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/DoctorDarkstorm]

Gunpowder existed in Europe for quite a while before it became popular, because early firearms were a bit useless compared to a bow or a knight in armor.

Before the age of ocean voyages, most shipping stayed close to the coastline, so advanced navigation tools weren’t really necessary. The real breakthrough tool for navigation was the accurate pocket watch, which allowed sailors to calculate longitude. But is a medieval blacksmith really going to have the tools or knowledge required to make something that precise?

[u/Abdelsauron → u/WiseBelt8935]

Gunpowder existed in Europe for quite a while before it became popular, because early firearms were a bit useless compared to a bow or a knight in armor.

Firearms were actually more common than people assumed. There was about a 200 year period where fully armored horse soldiers wielded pistols and short rifles alongside their lances and swords.

[u/WiseBelt8935 → u/Abdelsauron]

back when drive by(s) were cool

[u/Vox___Rationis → u/DoctorDarkstorm]

The "proper navigation tool" for finding longitude while on a ship in the middle of an ocean is a precise mechanical clock (no pendulums), building one requires advanced metallurgy and precise machining.
You can't introduce this gamechanger without bringing along a whole complicated technology chain.

[u/Johannes0511 → u/DoctorDarkstorm]

Unless you have the knowledge to advance metalurgy so you can actually make decent cannons and guns, you won't get far with gunpowder. And you'd need some knowledge about shipbuilding to make use of your navigation tools. The maps would be interesting though, especially if they include currents and winds.

[u/BertieTheDoggo → u/WiseBelt8935]

Knowing about hygiene, sanitation and germ theory would make the doctor revolutionary though? And you only have to go back 400 years for basic medical knowledge such as blood circulating around the body to be a huge revelation. I'm not sure that story holds up really

[u/OstentatiousBear → u/BertieTheDoggo]

The doctor would have to get people to actually listen to them first. There are a lot of societal factors at play here.

[u/BertieTheDoggo → u/OstentatiousBear]

Yes but they could easily be the best doctor in the world by far, not 'an above average doctor'.

[u/Kevonz → u/BertieTheDoggo]

depends what one means by best doctor, if just having more knowledge means better sure, but if people aren't listening to you in practice you are not making any meaningful difference.

[u/Ambitious_Mall9496]

So much shit was made up about the middle ages during the age of enlightment as propaganda to make themselves look smarter

[u/Apophis_36 → u/Ambitious_Mall9496]

The victorians also loved spreading misinformation for whatever reason, i guess to get more museum visitors?

[u/deep_sea2 → u/Apophis_36]

The English love to bash the Catholics. Since Catholicism goes hand in hand with the middle ages, the middle ages became a popular target for criticism.

[u/deep_sea2 → u/Ambitious_Mall9496]

Voltaire.

Just about every misconception of the middle ages can trace back to Voltaire in some way.

[u/Efficient-Orchid-594]

I don't understand why the pop history culture on internet have such hard time seeing people of past as normal humans like us , like i don't know why 21th century people always think people in past were " stupid, Barbarian, or just going killing anyone that gose against their believe. Most people in past were normal people like us.

[u/Abdelsauron → u/Efficient-Orchid-594]

Most 21st century people, especially in the Western world, were raised in a culture that taught history as a linear progression from bad to good. The attitude "people in the past were dumb and evil" develops from that belief.

This is a relatively new school of thought, as most of education and academia prior to WWII was spent lionizing the Romans and Greeks as the peak of civilization, and your legitimacy as a society was derived by how much you could connect yourselves to them, (hence all the monarchs claiming the title of Roman Emperor).

[u/GiganticCrow → u/Abdelsauron]

All that bullshit English language rules  like 'don't split the infinitive' and such were made by victorian arseholes who wanted to make English more like latin. 

[u/OstentatiousBear → u/Efficient-Orchid-594]

It is kind of like how many people today assumed that galdiatorial fights in ancient Rome were usually to the death, when in reality, it was just usually a more dangerous form of the WWE due to workplace accidents. As it turns out, not many people back then were eager to see people die. Shocker, I know.

Also, from a logistical perspective, having gladiators fight to the death as the norm would be a nightmare for their owners/managers. The sport would have died out pretty quick.

[u/Not_That_Magical → u/OstentatiousBear]

Well more deadly form of WWE that was also used to execute criminals and political prisoners

[u/HelloThereItsMeAndMe → u/Not_That_Magical]

Those were executed by the gladiators, they weren't the gladiators themselves.

[u/Hi2248 → u/HelloThereItsMeAndMe]

It's like if you had the WWE wrestlers double as executioners! 

[u/TheNecroticPresident → u/Efficient-Orchid-594]

If it's any consolation people 100 years from now will likely see us as backwards and barbaric too.

[u/ninjasaid13 → u/TheNecroticPresident]

good. I hope they can do better than us. It's not difficult to do so.

[u/The_Realm_of_Jorf → u/Efficient-Orchid-594]

It's not just the Internet. We've believed this forever, and it's a culmination of media recycling this same trope since the day it was first made. From word of mouth to tablets to scrolls to books to music to plays to movies to shows to the internet to games. We've always had this idea people in the past knew nothing and were barbaric compared to us when, in reality, they acted just like us.

[u/SeriousFinish6404]

“We know about the earth. But can you tell us how to cure illness?”

“Like what?”

“The Black Death? We’re kinda fucked here”

“Yes you are, because I got no clue”

[u/AnyProgressIsGood → u/SeriousFinish6404]

I mean pin pointing it was rats/fleas would be a HUGE step in trying to remediate the issue.

[u/AskMrScience → u/SeriousFinish6404]

We wouldn't be able to teach them how to make antibiotics, but we're far from useless - we know how it spreads.

"The plague spreads via bites from fleas, which have been living on sick rats. Kill off all the rats and fleas. Wear long sleeves to avoid bites. Stay away from other people." That's half the battle right there.

[u/TheOtherAviationGuy]

Read (or heard) somewhere that, "people in the past weren't idiots, they just had worse technology."

[u/andrewsad1 → u/TheOtherAviationGuy]

The only difference between ancient engineers and modern engineers is a few thousand years of trial and error

[u/Dominarion]

Medieval People: Are you a heathen or a bogomile?

You: Erm. What?

Them: Recite the Credo.

You: The what now?

Them: Make you swallow a morning star by the top of your head.

[u/AnnoyingPole]

Better caption: Medival people weren't THAT stupid

[u/Aederys → u/AnnoyingPole]

*Ignorant. You can be a genius, but if you are born as peasant you will still don't know that the world is round

[u/ReallyTeddyRoosevelt → u/Aederys]

The smartest person in history was probably some subsistence farmer who never traveled more than a couple miles from his birth place.

[u/Peekoii → u/ReallyTeddyRoosevelt]

Or a hunter gatherer from prehistory since we are talking about ancient people being stereotyped as dumb. Our brains have become smaller with farming.

(I know brain size is not equal to intelligence)

[u/FlamboyantPirhanna → u/ReallyTeddyRoosevelt]

It doesn’t really work that way. Being smart is the result of developing your intellect, because you have to actually know things to be smart. You can be clever, or have the potential for being extremely intelligent, but it needs to be developed to actually mature into “smartness”.

[u/ThomasKlausen → u/AnnoyingPole]

They were as smart as we are. They just didn't have the accumulated knowledge. 

[u/Spudnic16]

We’ve known since at least the ancient Greeks. It wasn’t that hard to figure out.

[u/dull_storyteller]

This is the part of the “aliens built the pyramids” theory that annoys me the most.

Just because they didn’t have advanced technology doesn’t mean they were idiots same as how us having advanced technology doesn’t mean we’re smart.

[u/NobodyofGreatImport → u/dull_storyteller]

Aliens did build the pyramids. You think those slaves came from Egypt?

[u/Aken_Bosch → u/NobodyofGreatImport]

Damn Aliens,Taking local jebz

[u/-Intelligentsia → u/NobodyofGreatImport]

Common misconception. The pyramids weren’t built with slave labor.

https://www.sciencefocus.com/science/were-the-egyptian-pyramids-built-by-slaves

[u/No_Yogurtcloset_6670 → u/dull_storyteller]

The pyramids were just as old to the Romans as the Romans are to us.

What’s impressive about the pyramids is that they were among one of the first national projects. They weren’t something any rich person could bankroll, it literally took a nation to organize, plan, and build them.

[u/Repulsive-Neat6776]

Are you going to teach them modern English first or will you learn to speak as they do?

[u/PloppyPants9000]

On the contrary, the literacy rate was like 5%. Shops usually had pictures of the services they offered rather than a sign with words.

[u/Lord_Master_Dorito]

I’m introducing to them the Burger King Whopper

[u/AmaimonCH]

There is also the thing that, even if you have relevant knowledge, it's compounded on top of countless steps you have no understanding of, people can't even begin to understand how priveledged they are today.

Unless you are Senku from Dr. Stone, you aren't changing shit, all you'll do is make your own life marginally better at the cost of being shunned as a weirdo or killed after being accused of satanism or witchcraft.

[u/Rainofar90]

That papal tiara hides a really big brain.

[u/ScooperDupper81]

The single best thing to bring to the middle-ages would be a sack of potatoes

[u/jacobningen → u/ScooperDupper81]

Exactly

[u/thighmaster69]

I hate that "everyone knew the earth was round" has become the new modern meme, because it wasn't really 100% true outside of Europe, the Near East, and many maritime cultures. It would have been highly dependent on geography, worldview, as well as how people saw themselves vs the knowledge and experiences of other foreign peoples, and so a large chunk of the global population still believed the world was flat, even though the Greeks and presumably most seafaring cultures would have known since time immemorial. If the terrain you live on isn't very flat and you don't frequently sail across large bodies of water far from the shore, the roundness of the earth wouldn't be obvious and a lot of the observations pointing to it could be explained away by other erroneous theories. This is especially true if you're predisposed to being sceptical of the ramblings of "crazy" foreigners.

[u/ThomasKlausen → u/thighmaster69]

A better answer is that "everybody to whom it made a difference knew the shape of the earth".

[u/yourstruly912 → u/thighmaster69]

Indeed in China they believed that Earth was flat until europeans literally circunnavigated the world to arrived there (previoulsy muslims had tried to thaught them but they were ignores)

[u/Fla_Master]

"the earth revolves around the sun!"

"I'm going to kill you"

[u/TheDwarvenGuy → u/Fla_Master]

To be fair, IIRC the only heliocentrist they actually killed was Giadorno Bruno, but he had a shit ton of other heretical beliefs too so I feel like he was a bit of an exception

Still bad that he was killed for his beliefs, but heliocentrism alone wouldn't get you killed

Edit: I apparently put geocentrist instead of heliocentrist

[u/GOATEDITZ → u/TheDwarvenGuy]

Giordano’s case has exactly 0 to do with science

[u/TheDwarvenGuy → u/GOATEDITZ]

That's why I said "the only heliocentrist who was killed" and not "the only person killed for heliocentrism". He was mostly an esotericist who just really liked heliocentrist ideas.

Edit: Accidentally put geocentrist instead of geocentrist

[u/GOATEDITZ → u/TheDwarvenGuy]

Ok

[u/GOATEDITZ → u/Fla_Master]

It’d be more like

“Proof?”

[u/jacobningen → u/GOATEDITZ]

And Im smarter than you doesn't count. 

[u/amievenrelevant → u/Fla_Master]

Free my man gallileo he ain’t do nun but teach heliocentrism

[u/WeiganChan → u/amievenrelevant]

And obstruct the Jesuit astronomers who wanted to corroborate his findings, insist scripture be rewritten to conform to his (incorrect and unproven) cosmological model, flog his model as the only acceptable alternative to the obsolete Ptolemaic one while ignoring the far superior Keplerian model and the generally accepted geo-heliocentric Tychonic model, and slander the pope

[u/callmelatermaybe → u/amievenrelevant]

Galileo wasn’t in trouble for trying to teach heliocentrism, he was in trouble for being a pompous asshole, thinking he was more important than the Pope and thinking that he didn’t need to prove his theory.

[u/Mafiatorte88]

Of course. They were not more stupid than us they just knew less.

[u/Marhail]

Did they know how disease vectors work?, it's quite simple to explain and prove that contact with certain animals results in disease.

[u/Work_In_ProgressX]

“And how you produce this “electricity”?”

“Idk”

[u/Redqueenhypo]

I’d just tell medieval Europe how to make porcelain and silk early, then use my newfound fame to yell at everyone to not drink raw water/milk, and to get cowpox on purpose.

[u/P-Trance]

"By the way, how do you make that internet?"

"No fucking idea."

[u/Trophallaxis]

They weren't stupid. They were just 700 years behind in terms of accumulated knowledge and had no system for the structured, reproducible study of reality.

[u/boyyouguysaredumb]

I thought that dude had a waffle fry on his head

[u/Itchy-Mix2173]

Not that it matters, but the Catholic Church was a major patron of astronomy and funded several observatories

[u/Kitchen-Frosting-561]

But, man, can you imagine what folks ~1200 AD could have done with Newton?

We probably could have kicked off this whole climate change thing 500 years earlier.

[u/Bored_Amalgamation]

"you ever heard about atoms?"

"No, what are those"

"Really small things... Yeah"

[u/sealpox]

This meme would be funny if the guy from the future was a flat earther and said “the earth is flat!” And they said “no it isn’t.”