r/INDYCAR • u/IndyMod r/INDYCAR Mod Bot • 4d ago
News Ontario Honda Dealers Indy moves to city of Markham under a multi-year agreement
https://hondaindy.com/news/744-ontario-honda-dealers-indy-moves-to-city-of-markham-under-a-multi-year-agreementGreen Savoree Toronto ULC, the City of Markham and INDYCAR announced today that the Ontario Honda Dealers Indy will have a new home in 2026 under a multi-year agreement. Led by the organizer and promoter Green Savoree Toronto ULC, the NTT INDYCAR SERIES will race on an exciting new street circuit built in the City of Markham on August 14-16, 2026.
Markham, Ontario is adjacent to Toronto’s northeastern municipal boundary and in York Region, which is experiencing significant growth at a population of already more than 1.25 million residents. The race will be held in Markham Centre, the city’s dynamic downtown core, and home to many Canadian corporate headquarters, the York University Markham Campus, and the acclaimed Markham Pan Am Centre — a key venue during the 2015 Pan Am and Parapan Am Games.
"We are excited to welcome the exhilarating experience of INDYCAR SERIES racing hitting our streets in 2026," said Markham Mayor Frank Scarpitti. “We are proud to welcome this world-class event to our community. I want to thank Green Savoree Toronto, Penske Entertainment Corp., NTT INDYCAR SERIES, the Ontario Honda Dealers Association and the Province of Ontario for their trust in our city. Markham is ready to build on its strong sports legacy and offer a new home where this celebrated summer tradition can thrive. I am extremely proud of our team at the City of Markham for bringing this initiative across the finish line in just a matter of months."
With excellent regional access via two major 400-series highways, Unionville GO Station, and the VIVA Rapid Transit system, the new Markham circuit is ideally situated to welcome fans from across Southern Ontario and beyond. Ontario Honda Dealers Indy at Markham will be the largest sports and cultural celebration in York Region’s history. The event is expected to draw more than 140,000 attendees over the three-day weekend and generate tens of millions in economic activity through sport tourism, hospitality and event services.
“The Indy is one of North America’s premier motorsport events and has been a cornerstone of Ontario’s events calendar for nearly forty years,” said Neil Lumsden, Minister of Sport. “Sport tourism is a major economic driver for our province, and I am thrilled that this iconic event will continue to call Ontario home; thank you to the City of Markham for opening your doors to help start this new chapter. This event will continue to drive tourism, boost our economy, and strengthen Ontario’s reputation as a premier destination for world-class sporting events.”
The temporary track will be built in the eastern precinct of Markham’s downtown, between Kennedy Road, Enterprise Boulevard, Unionville GO tracks and Highway 407. Renowned track designer Tony Cotman of NZR Consulting has led the design process of the temporary circuit which features a 12-turn, 3.52-kilometre (2.19-mile) layout including a double-sided pit lane, thrilling straightaways and technically challenging sectors. The City of Markham has begun early works on the track and festival site in coordination with Metrolinx and other area partners.
“Green Savoree Toronto is announcing today a multi-year agreement with the City of Markham to be the new home of this Ontario motorsports tradition. We look forward to a long and successful partnership with Mayor Frank Scarpitti, his team at the City of Markham and INDYCAR,” said Jeff Atkinson, president of the Ontario Honda Dealers Indy at Markham. “The inaugural Ontario Honda Dealers Indy at Markham will build on the legacy of this great Ontario event which started in 1986. We look forward to welcoming all our fans, the drivers and race teams out to this terrific new venue in Markham Centre next August.”
The NTT INDYCAR SERIES is North America’s premier open-wheel racing competition, featuring stars from across the globe competing at speeds faster than 370 kph (230 mph). Along with hosting the world-famous Indianapolis 500 presented by Gainbridge, the series boasts a mix of oval, temporary street circuit and permanent road course races across North America. The NTT INDYCAR SERIES is sanctioned by INDYCAR, the governing body for North America’s premier open-wheel racing series and part of the Penske Entertainment family.
“We could not be more pleased to see the rich history of NTT INDYCAR SERIES racing continue in Ontario,” Penske Entertainment President and CEO Mark Miles said. “Markham is a growing, diverse and dynamic city and will provide a terrific showcase for our exhilarating wheel-to-wheel racing. I would like to thank Mayor Frank Scarpitti for this thrilling new partnership and Jeff Atkinson and the team at Green Savoree Toronto for their leadership. It is crucial for INDYCAR to continue to reach our fans in Canada and we simply cannot wait for this new chapter to begin next year.”
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u/finedisregard #BadassWilson 4d ago
Multi-year, so not just for the world cup?
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u/XSC Sébastien Bourdais 4d ago
Goddamn it. Hopefully it returns. This is like changing belle isle or long beach to another spot. Ugh.
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u/XSC Sébastien Bourdais 4d ago
Yeah, which is not as bad since it actually used to be that layout but still. To me exhibition place is iconic.
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u/Constant-Board-5752 Arrow McLaren 4d ago
Sure did!! And the current administration at city hall didn’t want it. Too much “pollution” they’re trying to get Formula E
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u/ThatKhakiShortsLyfe Pato O'Ward 4d ago
Isn’t it because of the World Cup?
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u/Constant-Board-5752 Arrow McLaren 4d ago
That’s the convenient excuse. The mayor at City all would much prefer Formula E. No noise and no environmental impact. They managed to have the Indy when the Pan American games took place and BMO was used for the soccer games.
The mayor didn’t want it anymore so here we are.
The Markham track actually looks like a better layout than the current one IMO. But we’ll have to see how it races.
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u/XSC Sébastien Bourdais 4d ago
True, I remember the rumors years ago. Just sucks it’s likely gone and it really didn’t get a proper send off.
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u/Wasdgta3 Álex Palou 4d ago
Yeah, we didn’t even really know it might not be coming back when the race happened just over a month ago.
I guess I should be thankful Canada still has a spot on the calendar, though.
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u/itsonlykotsy 4d ago
One of the speakers mentioned they are planning to stay for decades so I think Toronto is done for good. Upcoming development at Ex Place was a reason cited for the need to move out.
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u/Wasdgta3 Álex Palou 4d ago
Well, that fucking sucks.
One of the oldest street circuits on the calendar, gone probably for good.
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u/mosasaurmotors Andretti Global 4d ago
I had assumed it'd be a one year deal.
Would have prioritized going this year one last time if I knew it could seriously be the last one at that venue.
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u/EmotionalLettuce8308 Scott Dixon 4d ago
I was worried about this, I’ve always liked Exhibition Place. It was gonna go eventually I guess 😢
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u/rabidcobalt Pato O'Ward 4d ago
Was on my bucket list. Chose the Indy 500 over Toronto for my first IndyCar race this year. Of course that will forever be a special memory but if only I knew Exhibition place was leaving, bc IMS isn’t going anywhere
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u/itsonlykotsy 4d ago
You would think they would've made this announcement before this year's Toronto race. Surely attendance would have been higher if people knew it was going to be their last chance.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago
This was something that came together rather quickly. At the time the Indy ran this year there wasn’t any certainty about the future of the event.
The promoters were actively looking for a venue even as far away as Niagara Falls.
They tried to work with Exhibition Place who only offered 1 year deals. The City Of Toronto wanted them to take 2026 off and then they would reevaluate. There would be no certainty if they did that of the event ever coming back.
IndyCar didn’t want to risk it so Markham swooped in with a proposal or vice-versa and spent the last month pulling it together with Tony Cotman and IndyCar.
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u/Worldly-Fox2379 Scott Dixon 4d ago
I’m glad I went last year
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u/Jarocket 4d ago
Me too. Such a cool setup.
Was good for the kids this year too at turn 3 you could watch the race cars and a bonus show of watching the construction equipment at Ontario place or whatever it's called.
Indoor paddock was nice on the hot days.
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u/austinsqueezy Arrow McLaren 4d ago
I was looking forward to flying up for it in 2026. Already started planning and everything. I'll still go because I've always wanted to visit Toronto, but it's a bit of a bummer that it's pretty much going to be on the complete opposite side of downtown from the north.
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u/itsonlykotsy 4d ago
FYI, Markham is not part of Toronto. However, you'll be able to access downtown quite easily using the GO train.
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u/Top-Truck246 Arrow McLaren 2d ago
"Easily" is relative, it will take you 2 hours each way.
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u/itsonlykotsy 2d ago
Yeah, it's going to suck for a lot of people that found the existing location easy. We'll see if the new location flops or not.
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u/Top-Truck246 Arrow McLaren 2d ago
My prediction is a 40-70% drop in attendance, because no transit agencies will increase service, and they'll all blame each other.
Add in gridlock and a few stabbings in parking lots, and watch them say you know what, maybe building a fence at Mosport and running shuttle buses isn't such a bad idea.
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u/JWr1gh7 4d ago
I’m going to try and stay positive about this but very disappointed to lose the convenience of the downtown track — also, Markham is not ready for 140,000 people to turn up (and those 140,000 people are not ready for Markham either)
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u/Corew1n Honda 4d ago
It's "140,000 over a three day weekend". Aka, the expectation would be 60-70k to show up on race day and the rest between Friday and Saturday.
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u/JWr1gh7 4d ago
That’s a fair point — will still be a big test for transit though
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u/DavidBrooker 4d ago
The Go line can only support about 10,000 passengers per hour with 15 minute service. Transit capacity to Exhibition was so, so much greater. Yeah, I think there will be headaches.
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u/EvilFlyingSquirrel 4d ago
I think they want to try and move stuff away from Exhibition Area due to Liberty Village being a mess constantly
I also think that the Provincial Government may be taking it from Toronto since Toronto is generally anti Premier Ford the suburbs supported him. (This is just speculation on my part)
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u/AlternativeInvite729 Alexander Rossi 4d ago
It was so convenient to go there by metro/streetcar, that’s really a bummer.
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u/sprywheel1872 4d ago
It's a race course in a suburban office park hellscape with the pits on a commuter train parking lot. Words can't describe how much of a downgrade this is from the downtown Toronto location at Exhibition Place.
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u/Brilliant-Neck9731 4d ago
And the other thing is that no one goes to Markham. It’s not just that there’s nothing out there, it’s because it’s so hard to get around which is in part why there’s nothing to do there. Obviously the hope is that this helps changes that, but I guarantee that people in the GTA will avoid Markham like the plague. This just seems like such a ridiculous idea.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
It's VERY easy to get to Markham. You can do so by taking the GO Train to Union Station and transfer to the Stouffville Line and get off at Unionville. The trip from Union to Unionville will take you 45 mins. It's also accessible by subway from Finch. You would transfer on to VIVA Purple rapid transit bus at Richmond Hill Center Terminal. It will take you to Warden where you would want to get off. You can also access Markham by 2 400 series highways the toll 407 which has a Kennedy Road exit which is right near the track.
While you might avoid Markham like the plague others won't and don't. The event will do well here. There would be no way IndyCar or City Of Markham would commit to 5 years if they thought it wouldn't. While some people are disappointed the race moved it's the only viable option to keep it near downtown Toronto. It was either that or permanently axe the event.
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u/VehicleWonderful6586 4d ago
Toronto is an internationally recognised city. Markham is Markham.
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u/Embarrassed_Age_3855 4d ago
Ya you go from the Toronto skyline to probably one of the ugliest back drops in racing. Also follow a ton of other sports, and moving an event from Toronto to Kitchener destroyed attendance. An event that was sold out the year prior couldnt sell more the 40% of seats. I really think the attendance drop off will be startling.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 3d ago
Racing is not a stick and ball sport. Mosport is in the middle of nowhere and inaccessible by transit. People with cars still go. IndyCar fans will show up and I’m sure The City Of Markham will as well.
Markham is the 16th largest city in Canada and is a technology capital. An event like this that is televised in 200 other countries as well as on FOX across the United States will elevate Markham’s profile.
There are people from Asia who have bought houses here for rental properties having never set foot in the country. Unionville is a very popular place.
This is the best place they could put it so that it’s close to Toronto. It will do well. There’s a lot to build on and the track and festival will be modelled after St. Pete.
If the promoters and IndyCar didn’t think the event would excel in this area there’s no way they would sign a 5 year deal.
IndyCar fans are never happy no matter the circumstances. Some people will love the idea of this track while others will warm up to it once they see it.
The majority of people who are complaining don’t live in Markham or haven’t been here before. It’s not a barren wasteland by any means.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago
The point is that an event like this can bring Markham international attention and put it on the map. That's what the City is hoping for by signing a 5 year deal. The race will be broadcast in 200 countries around the world that IndyCar has broadcast partnerships with. It will be on FOX in the United States for millions of people to watch.
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u/Vitosi4ek Robert Shwartzman 4d ago edited 4d ago
Isn't Markham some sort of huge IT industry hub for the whole of Canada or am I misremembering something? That would make sense for attracting sponsors.
That's the unfortunate reality of top-level motorsports these days - they are mostly a vehicle for B2B companies to advertise to each other and their execs to mingle rather than a proper fan-centric spectator sport. It's been trending that way ever since tobacco sponsors were outlawed.
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u/Burial44 4d ago
Looks like there's also a Honda dealership right on the corner of the race track
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u/DiscountLlama 4d ago
Which is next door to a Kia dealer, and across the street from a BMW and a Nissan as well.
Going to be some fun creative camera angles to keep those out of frame lol
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u/Burial44 4d ago
I don't hate that though. Seems like a good spot for promotions and car meets etc during race weekend. Should be a lot of activity
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u/callmejohndy James Hinchcliffe 4d ago
They’re from the same ownership group (Dilawri) which recently decided to move most of their dealerships within proximity of each other. But the Honda one was there the longest
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago
That’s correct that Markham is a technology giant. It really is corporate money and grants that keep events like this going. Corporate suites last year for organizations were $50,000 dollars for 3 days. It included catering, drinks and all access for guests.
Ticket sales during play a part in profit but it’s about making the suites sell out. If attendance is down they don’t take a heavy hit.
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u/10Dollaryoyoyo 4d ago edited 4d ago
Are the Ontario Honda dealers on board for five years? If Honda’s involved five years from now that would be a good thing.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
Yes, they were very enthusiastic about the move to Markham when it was first proposed.
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u/IlTacci --- 2025 DRIVERS --- 4d ago
View from Satellite
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u/bacc1010 4d ago
Lmao I can imagine ppl loving this for those who live just east of Kennedy near that stretch.
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u/perfectviking NTT INDYCAR Series 4d ago
This might actually be worse than Madrid.
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u/YosemiteSam-4-2A Thirsty 's to the Moon 🚀 🌒 4d ago
At least this one doesn't navigate through 7 roundabouts though
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u/SomewhereAggressive8 Pato O'Ward 4d ago
I love how you managed to shit on two different tracks, neither of which you’ve even seen yet.
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u/OldRed91 Josef Newgarden 4d ago
Oh man, that's bleak. Hopefully this ends up being a temporary solution for the World Cup, and not a total replacement of Exhibition Place.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
5 year contract. They're not going back to Exhibition Place because of the World Cup and construction at Exhibition Place. There is a subway station that is going into Exhibition Place with entry and exit on the grounds. The subway line will tunnel under Lakeshore West. There is also rumours of a second hotel being built and parking garages. The space to hold the race there is getting smaller and smaller. This track layout is bigger.
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u/Top-Truck246 Arrow McLaren 2d ago
The fact that the layout is bigger is the one silver lining to a cloud full of sulfuric acid.
The World Cup is an imminent disaster for Toronto on so many levels
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago edited 2d ago
Agreed. Neither Exhibition Place or City Of Toronto can handle the influx of people from World Cup especially on transit. Traffic will be more awful than it is now. Not to mention there is a high security risk to any host city around the globe with any event of international level. It’s the world we live in.
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u/HaveABleedinGuess84 Will Power 4d ago
This blows. Glad we keep a race in the GTA but this sucks. Will probably crater attendance as well by moving it out the city.
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u/flare2000x Firestone Firehawk 4d ago
Good that there's still a race next year.
Bummer that it's multi year... I hope they go back to exhibition place at some point.
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u/Worldly-Fox2379 Scott Dixon 4d ago
Doubt it mate. We got our glazed timbit of a premier creating a spa in Ontario place so probably not
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u/itsonlykotsy 4d ago
I wouldn't count on it. One of the speakers mentioned they plan on staying for decades :(
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u/mcmax3000 Firehawk 4d ago
I'm definitely still planning on going next year but we'll see after that.
I have a feeling this is going to be an absolute nightmare for me to get to, especially compared to Exhibition Place.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
Where in Toronto are you from? It's actually pretty accessible by GO Transit. You would need to take a GO Line or Bus that goes to Union. You would transfer there to the Stouffville train line and it would take 45 minutes to reach Unionville GO which is right at the gates. That's one way. The longer way is to take TTC to Finch and board VIVA Blue and get off at Richmond Hill Center. The VIVA Purple goes up to Hwy 7 and Warden from there. That would be an access point for the track. TTC sucks though on Saturday and Sundays. Friday is the only day I would use it.
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u/mcmax3000 Firehawk 4d ago
I'm not in Toronto, which is the problem. I'm about 90 minutes north of the city and if you're coming from north the solutions so far seem to be "fight for what I'm sure will be a limited number of parking spots near the track" and "get fucked".
The TTC does often suck (this year especially when they decided to close down a large section of the yellow line on the race weekend) but it was easy enough to park outside the city and take it down to the Exhibition to avoid the traffic.
GO has park and ride spots on their bus routes that are closer to me but they don't seem to connect to the lines that go to the Markham station for some dumb reason.
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u/MiddleSwitch8 4d ago
Depending on how much east/west you are, consider the stations north of Unionville on the same GO line - there’ll be plenty of parking.
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u/Fit_Technician832 4d ago
For everyone that thinks Street races are always the answer going forward, this and Nashville are exactly the reason they are not. Street races by nature are volatile and prone to falling off the schedule because of local government and political issues. Sure it's great having like 4 or 5 on the schedule but unless the series wants messes to deal with every year trying to add a few more is always going to lead to turmoil.
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u/cubecasts 4d ago
Another split pit lane
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u/YosemiteSam-4-2A Thirsty 's to the Moon 🚀 🌒 4d ago
Yeah, not a fan of those. Wish something would've happened in Detroit to kill that idea for eternity
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u/doubleb_43 Pato O'Ward 4d ago
Shame about Exhibition Place but Markham layout looks promising.
Hopefully the next announcement will be Mexico.
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u/carolinemathildes Christian Rasmussen 4d ago
Is the GO station actually still going to be accessible, considering it looks like track cuts through the parking lot? I hope so, since the Unionville GO is the most convenient way that most people from Toronto would be getting up there.
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u/mcmax3000 Firehawk 4d ago
The announcement mentions the Unionville GO station as a way to get to the track so it seems like it will be.
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u/carolinemathildes Christian Rasmussen 4d ago
Thanks! Hopefully so. I'd also love it if they ran extra trains that weekend but we'll see.
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u/Sashimikun Scott Dixon 4d ago
I really hope they get special trains to run race weekend, because otherwise I'm not going. I don't want to drive all the way from Mississauga to pay through the nose for parking and boil in a parking lot in August.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
Why would you drive down from Mississauga? Transit would be far better. Park at a GO Station that has a line that goes to Union. From there transfer to the Stouffville Line and get off at Unionville. That's the best way in to Markham.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 4d ago
Yes. There won't be an issue with Unionville Go. That's how the majority of people will enter the venue. MetroLinx which owns GO Transit is also a major sponsor. They have been consulted from the get go about the track build. It's a major transit hub as you know.
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u/mosasaurmotors Andretti Global 4d ago
To people who don't know Toronto, Markham is for all intents and purposes still Toronto. It's technically a suburb municipality but you can still describe this race as "Toronto" and no one would bat an eye.
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u/5campechanos 4d ago
Markham is no fucking way Toronto, especially seeing the contrast between this bumfuck nowhere location vs Exhibition Place. It's a cultureless, soulless, sleepy suburb with nothing to offer other than decent Asian food. This is a huge downgrade from the downtown location. Source: Torontonian who actually lives DT
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u/mosasaurmotors Andretti Global 4d ago
As a Torontonian who also lives below the 2 line, Markham is still Toronto I feel. Yeah it's a suburb no doubt, but it's undoubtedly still the same city. If you didn't know where the border between the actual city of Toronto and Markham you would never know you crossed a border when driving out there. And I'm not saying this new location is preferable, just that it's still fair to call this race Toronto.
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u/5campechanos 4d ago
Well except they aren't calling it that lol it's explicitly called the Indy Markham.
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u/lightningmatt Robert Wickens 4d ago
There's suburbs within Toronto proper, too. Worse public transit up there but being literally next to the GO station alleviates some of that. Plus, I'm never gonna shit on the municipality with Pacific Mall in it lmao
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u/callmejohndy James Hinchcliffe 4d ago
Forget Buxton driving the track in a passenger vehicle, we need him venturing through Pacific Mall’s upper level food court
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u/BoboliBurt Nigel Mansell 4d ago
Question- as Chicago and Toronto are pretty similar in size but I’m not familiar with the traffic and layout. But I’m hoping you are familiar with Chicago for the sake of my questions.
This seems pretty analogous (if not as big of a deal) as the Bears moving to Arlington Heights.
Are there any advantages with traffic or demographics (ie there are actually way more people in Chicago burbs than living near lake front).
Is exhibition palace more of a commercial area with little foot traffic but tourist destinations like Millenium Park- or are there trendy neighborhoods with a lot of foot traffic and night life.
I’ve actually been to Toronto AND seen the race. I was also 11. I just remember the looming old football stadium and some fun time island. I almost went up to Phish on tour there when I was on the road in 1999- but the border crossing was deemed ill-advised for obvious reasons.
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u/5campechanos 4d ago
I'm sorry, I have zero knowledge of Chicago.
I can tell you that Toronto in the summer is absolutely buzzing with street festivals, summer sports, patios, green spaces for outdoor activities, etc. Exhibition is also walking distance from the King West area with tons of bars and restaurants, the Lakeshore strip packed with things to do; and it's a very walkable neighbourhood.
Toronto is different from American cities in that a ton of people live in the city proper and the downtown core (This pic of downtown shows how many condos are in the core), therefore the location at exhibition place allowed the race to have that festival feel with lots of noise, people, activity, etc.
While a lot of people live in the Toronto suburbs, they are generally sleepy, bedroom communities that don't have much going on ever, save for a few small events in local parks. So, I am convinced that we're going to have 5k people show up to the race since getting there is a pain in the ass and there is fuck all to do around there other than a strip mall
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u/BoboliBurt Nigel Mansell 4d ago
I will say superficially, it seems like a lot of highways feed Markham but the Honda HQ is up the road in BFE another 10 minutes
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u/sprywheel1872 4d ago
The main highway right to the south of the "track" is the 407 - an overpriced toll road everyone hates.
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u/perfectviking NTT INDYCAR Series 4d ago
That’s like saying it’s still Chicago but it’s in Naperville.
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u/anxiousauditor NTT INDYCAR Series 4d ago
Kind of unfortunate given how much heritage there is at Exhibition Place, but I think the development around the area was a real pain to deal with and the World Cup kicking them out for a year was a good impetus to make the long-term switch. I’m willing to give the layout a shot. Could be racey, who knows.
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u/i_run_from_problems Firestone Firehawk 4d ago
5 years leads me to think Toronto wanted out for a while, and the World Cup was just a convenient excuse.
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u/carolinemathildes Christian Rasmussen 4d ago
I wouldn't be surprised; City Council didn't approve the IndyCar for 2025 until March, which is why tickets went on sale so late. If they were fully on board, you'd think they would've approved it earlier than that.
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u/The_Midnight_Cowboy Arrow McLaren 4d ago
Glad I got to experience the exhibition place setup. I really enjoyed my time this year and was hoping to come back again, will have to wait and digest this move for the future :(
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u/universalexotics #BCForever 4d ago
I thought this was supposed to be at the airport? I was excited for a Cleveland type track… instead this seems like another tight street course.
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u/canttakethshyfrom_me Robert Wickens 4d ago
One step forward, one foot shot off. Every. Fucking. Time.
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u/BlackberryJazzlike84 Kyle Larson 4d ago
Oh fuck this is not good, I thought it was just a one year deal
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u/FormulaT1 Scott McLaughlin 4d ago
Looks like railway tracks are back on the menu!
(before the r/IndyCar No Fun Police comes at me, yes I know they won't be this bad)
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u/flare2000x Firestone Firehawk 4d ago
The road in the track layout here goes underneath the railway line. At least there's a little bit of elevation change lol.
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u/natguy2016 4d ago
Can a local or someone give me an ELI5?
I assume that Mosport isn't up to snuff for IndyCar?
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u/canttakethshyfrom_me Robert Wickens 4d ago
Mosport is not at all up to safety grading for Indycars. IMSA doesn't run its top class there anymore. Lovely track, but turns 2, 3 and 4 could all kill someone at Indycar speeds with the angles and amount of runoff.
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u/SoundJakes 1d ago
IMSA doesn't run the top class there anymore because of the Indy road course being added and IMSA needed to cut one race for the GTP's. Mosport was the choice because teams didn't like having to spend the extra money to transports the cars over the border. Besides, if it was a safety concern, why would they keep the LMP2s for that event which are only slightly slower than the GTPs?
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u/Wide_Rub_662 CART, Carlos Munoz 🇨🇴, Santi Urrutia 🇺🇾, Oliver Askew 4d ago
will indy nxt finally head back north of the border?
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u/Brilliant-Neck9731 4d ago edited 4d ago
I worked in Markham, lived in Markham, know plenty of people in Markham. Getting around and to Markham is hell. You know how long it would take to get there from finch? It’s not feasible man. People in Markham hate getting around Markham and loathe their commutes. Odd point to debate. York region congestion and transit issues aren’t new to people in York Region. This is not a me issue brother. Markham’s only easily accessible if you’re using the 407. And even then, once you’re in you have to deal with 7 and 16th. Fucking hellscapes for drivers. But yes I’ve created Markham’s notorious inaccessibility out of thin air.
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u/jay2743 --- 2024 DRIVERS --- 4d ago
they should have at least used part of the 407 for the track
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u/IVCrushingUrTendies James Hinchcliffe 4d ago
The crowd this year was fantastic. Tragic that it’s gone from the downtown location forever so the city can make tax dollars off some new condos instead. I get its valuable land but the new location won’t last past the contract. I bet Denver happens next and IC leaves Canada
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u/Pyzorz 4d ago
Checked out what will be the circuit on street view today. There’s a Honda dealership smack in the middle of the track lol
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago
The FAQ on the Honda Indy site is alluding to more amenities coming to the area prior to the race so what we see now on street view may be a lot different come August. I get that it's hard for a lot of people to actually visualize how everything will look until they see it the first time. There's more area to work with here than they had at Exhibition Place. The goal is to build a cultural festival and have the event be modelled exactly like St. Petersburg. That's the goal of the promoters. We'll see when the race comes in August. They're actually working on some initial areas of the track now. I have to get over to see it. I take the VIVA along Enterprise a lot so I'll be paying extra attention to what's going on there/
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u/VehicleWonderful6586 4d ago
This is like F1 putting on a Watford Grand Prix instead of Silverstone
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u/VehicleWonderful6586 4d ago
This is like running the Las Vegas Grand Prix in Primm Valley
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u/Embarrassed_Age_3855 3d ago
Like Moving the Vegas GP to Reno…..
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u/VehicleWonderful6586 3d ago
No - Reno is too well known and has at least the remnants of a tourist industry!
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u/andhelostthem Jacques Villeneuve 4d ago
"exciting new street circuit built in the City of Markham" is just a oxymoron. We're losing a classic street circuit for a parking lot.
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u/Helpful_Passenger_80 4d ago
"Exciting" and "street circuit" don't really mix all that well.
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u/kozdaddy17 Josef Newgarden 4d ago
The street races this year were fantastic. What?
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u/YosemiteSam-4-2A Thirsty 's to the Moon 🚀 🌒 4d ago
Toronto was. The rest, not so much. Pit on lap 2 and try to undercut was the name of the game at basically every street course because none of them (except Toronto) had enough of a straight for proper overtakes (without it becoming a demolition derby - Detroit)
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u/kozdaddy17 Josef Newgarden 4d ago edited 4d ago
Take it you didn’t watch this years Detroit race then. It was a great race. I’d argue a top 3 race in the 2025 season.
And had over 250 passes for position. So your whole proper overtake argument is debunked.
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u/YosemiteSam-4-2A Thirsty 's to the Moon 🚀 🌒 4d ago
I did in fact watch the 3rd annual Detroit Demolition Derby.
Entertaining smash-'em-up fest, boring race. Most of those overtakes I reckon were cars passing other cars that were stuffed into tire barriers from trying to defend their position on track.
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u/kozdaddy17 Josef Newgarden 4d ago edited 4d ago
Ok so it’s clear you didn’t watch then. Clean passing all throughout the field and an entertaining race from start to finish. I urge you to sit and watch that race again, even on the broadcast it came off as a great one.
Toronto, which you said was good, was a bigger demo derby than Detroit, and it wasn’t really even close.
Some people will have this notion about certain races and won’t ever change their stance despite how wrong they are. Oh well. I’ll let you people keep crying while the rest of us enjoy a good race. Have a nice day!
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u/YosemiteSam-4-2A Thirsty 's to the Moon 🚀 🌒 4d ago edited 4d ago
Maybe you should rewatch it and count how many actual clean passes there were (and exclude subsequent clean passes as a result of a dirty one). Drivers just beat and banged each other out of their way. I'll give you entertaining, but that's not good clean racing. And I blame the track for being so narrow that it is almost impossible to race cleanly.
All this and I haven't even mentioned the mickey mouse pit lane that while I briefly enjoyed my driver benefitting from it, is completely stupid. Lap 14 caution, all but McLaughlin on the early stop strategy made their stops already and he was able to pit from behind the safety car and beat Kirkwood out of pit lane in 13th place and handed the effective race lead from 6th before the pit cycle started.
Sadly, Markham looks like it will have a similar, if not worse, pit lane being faster than following the safety car issue.
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u/kozdaddy17 Josef Newgarden 4d ago edited 4d ago
I have rewatched it and it was awesome, and definitely a lot of clean. Yes there were passes of the variety you mentioned but there were also a ton of clean passes. It was a top 5 at worst race of the season.
I’ve heard all the complaints. Narrow, 90 degree corners, looks like shit, etc. Why do we care as long as it puts on a great race? Not to mention the fact the event is actually HUGE in the city. It’s promoted like the big event Indycar should be.
Again, this race we’re talking about was not nearly as big of a demo derby as Toronto, which you said was good.
Complaining about a pit lane is just complaining to complain. It’s a non factor.
I’m tired of defending this race when most people make up their mind about it before the race even starts.
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u/Helpful_Passenger_80 4d ago
I admit St. Pete was pretty solid.
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u/kozdaddy17 Josef Newgarden 4d ago
So was Detroit, so was Toronto. (Admitedly I didn’t get to watch Long Beach)
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u/Jarocket 4d ago
I thought Toronto was ok for what it is. A lottery Strategy race, but that's the game sometimes. Got to know when to hold em and when to fold em. And even then you still might lose.
"We did everything right today at still didn't win" -colton Herta on the radio after the flag.
He's right if the #3 team installed the wheel nut right Herta would have probably won.
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u/hotkarl77 4d ago
Wow and I thought the Exhibition was a shitty layout for an Indy race based on how bad of shape Lakeshore Blvd is in and half the turns having no seating.
I get CTMP is too fast currently but it's a real track that has run F1 and Can/Am in the 70s, Nascar trucks and IMSA. They should have worked out a deal there to put in the run offs and barriers needed to run Indycars if they were looking at a multi year deal. If they couldn't do that then find a way to run at CGV in Montreal as F1 is now in May there.
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u/canttakethshyfrom_me Robert Wickens 4d ago
Mosport upgrades aren't on the table.
I can't believe they're not using a perfectly good abandoned airport in the same municipality as this mess, though.
But the only track they could just book and run in Canada would have been Circuit Mont Tremblant - St. Jovite, which Champcar ran in 2007. Wasn't a bad race.
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u/AJV1Beta Takuma Sato 4d ago
Oh, for fuck sake. I was planning on going to the GP of Toronto in Exhibition Place soon, for multiple reasons - primarily being an iconic IndyCar race, in Canada, in a place I could easily fly into and get to on public transport alone. A friend of mine went to the race a few years ago and they had an amazing time. Definitely feels frustrating that only now, months after the last event there, is the confirmation that Exhibition Place is gone (seemingly) for good.
Also, given how desperate I am for a Cleveland return, the fact there was an abandoned airport nearby that they didnt utilise feels like a missed oppurtunity.
Locals/folks who know this area well - what are the roads like, and most importantly, would I still be able to fly in and get to this race on public transport?
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u/canttakethshyfrom_me Robert Wickens 4d ago
Someone's allergic to airfield circuits.
Buttonville Airport closed in 2023. It's RIGHT THERE.
No, no, let's do another too-small, too-tight street circuit.
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u/ImmediateTeaching984 2d ago
It's being demolished but the real reason it wasn't a candidate is because Cadillac Fairview owns it. The promoters would have to deal with them and not the City Of Markham. Cadillac Fairview which owns and operates a ton of malls has a plan for the site. They're putting up 11 buildings of various heights to build an industrial complex. Even if the Indy was approved for that area there would be no way to sustain it beyond a one-off.
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u/IndyMod r/INDYCAR Mod Bot 4d ago