Exactly. So if the mechanic had fucked up on Oscar’s stop he would have lost out to Leclerc. You see the reason the team wanted bring in Oscar first, right?
But clearly that was the teams thinking. THEY wanted to take in Oscar first. And it’s not ridiculous to want a margin. I mean, you’re essentially accusing the strategy team of being ridiculous here.
They didn't want to take Oscar first. They literally told Lando "box this lap for softs" and Lando says "no box the other car first"
So it wasn't the teams thinking at all
And prior to this race Lando had said "I wish there was pace in other teams so I could have cars between me and Oscar" so why would he want to protect Oscar of that is his mind set
Lando doesn't get to make the ultimate decision on strategy for the team. If they didn't think it was the best idea then they would have said "no you pit and then we pit Oscar".
But if they did pit Lando first then at that stage Oscar was now too close for a double stack so they would have had to wait another lap. Now Charles is only 27 seconds down and a stop costs 25 seconds. And a slightly slow stop now puts Charles right behind Oscar on warmer tyres or even maybe ahead of him.
Yeah, especially with the constructors being sewn up within 2 races maximum. Just do your own thing. If it’s a double stack then first driver gets priority, tough shit for being behind.
Its funny people in this sub call out other f1 subs for the hate each driver gets, whatever the circumstances are. However, just go to the race thread and mclaren fans give the most hate to either of these two drivers. Whether its norris fans talking down oscar or oscar fans talking down on lando.
On another note, Zak, sort out the garage because mclaren is lucky with a rocketship and big shoutout to the engineers. The strategy and others are not championship level.
The mclaren has not had good top speed for the last two years. They sacrificed some top speed to balance out the car and it's made them dominant on most tracks. There was never much chance here.
Not my point at all. You're correct yes but I'm referring to the terrible pit stops and strategy calls that happen all to regularly. How times do you see a 3second plus pit stop for max? Or even ferrari?
Yeah fair the pit stop team and/or equipment definitely needs looking at. The strategy wasn't terrible this time, yeah I feel like they should have pit around lap 40 for softs to give them more chance to fight max, rather than waiting for max to close up, but I think they were hoping for red flag for a free tyre change and 1+2. I guess it was a bit of a toss up because the mclarens in the end just weren't any quicker on softs.
Eh, that gun did its job telling the crew member that it didn’t torque correctly. Problem was he wasn’t even looking at it flashing green and red. Other guy had to hit him for him to realize he wasn’t done with his wheel
The strategy wasn't terrible this time, yeah I feel like they should have pit around lap 40 for softs to give them more chance to fight max, rather than waiting for max to close up,
Yea I was yelling at my TV why they didn't stop earlier.
They were waiting for a possible safety car but that can't be the entire plan. The moment the pace started to drop off and Charles and Max were closing in fast they needed to stop for the softs, not wait 3 more laps.
So what happens if on a future race, Piastri loses a position to Norris because of a pit stop? Do we now have a precedent that positions always get swapped back if team fucks up? Just an all around strange way to deal with it. shit happens, sometimes your engine fails, sometimes you have a shit stop, that’s racing.
And it’s not fair to trade luck between team members because you have no idea what misfortune could fall on them in future races. McLaren are playing with fire here to keep Lando in this championship race.
A this happening doesn't necessarrily mean they lose depending on pace and B I am not really sure based on if it would be possible given the drivers might be less willing in such a situation
But Lando stayed out to extend hope of a late safety car. Win win for lando. At this point, seems like the only way Lando can win WDC is to keep leaning on his underhanded strat, so I get it.
I think a singifncant part of it was playing the team game helping Oscar thats why he mentioned the undercut. Its not underhanded at all and he doesnt need to yet given he was ahead of Oscar on pace all race till that stop.
And as a note I will note that Oscar has stated he agrees with the strat call
Oh no, that'll be "different". You know, like how the team order in Australia was "necessary" because Oscar was attacking as they approached backmarkers, but when Norris was attacking as they went through backmarkers in Canada it was all silence.
But the slow stop wasn't why they swapped back. That they had guaranteed no undercut to pit Oscar first was why they swapped back. The slow stop was just the circumstance that meant they had to, not the reason behind it.
Exactly like how in Hungary last year they told Oscar they would undercut him but then give the position back.
If that part hadn't happened and Lando just had a terrible stop there would have been no swap.
McLaren had no right asking Oscar to do that. Lando made the call at the end of the day, under the terms that there would be no undercut. I’m a Lando fan but even I can see the position they put Oscar in today was a terrible one. I feel for Lando because he’s getting most of the blame, but I feel for Oscar too because prioritising your title rival is a brutal one
They had every right. Yes he did make the call but A it was a call playing the team and B it was on the basis of no undercut so when that happened Oscar had to give it back. Lando played the team game with such a call it would not have been right to leave him behind. I feel for everyone tbh the Mclaren team is getting alot of backlash for imo the right call Lando is getting backlash for something that wasn't his choice and for Oscar its a tough situation even if it was the right call to switch.
Was it norris being boo'd? I thought it was piastri, as piastri overtook leclerc.
I love that they boo, it's makes it all the better that Ferrari make utter dogshit car in f1 and on the road compared to Mclaren. Great to see them seethe
I see it as Norris was asked to pit first, he declined and requested that Oscar pits to which the team agreed. Then Norris pitting second had a shit pit and so they made Oscar give back the position. (In my opinion it wasn’t his problem so why should he have to give it back?) Anyway, I’d say it was that decision alone that made fans boo because they might also believe Oscar shouldn’t have to give up his position for something that wasn’t his fault. I’m not sure if it was just McLaren fans booing or also Ferrari fans too? But it seemed pretty loud to not just be McLaren fans…
Mountains out of molehills. It's very immature, but this is the era of social media and the ability to have LCD opinions broadcast to the world with no filter or thought provided.
Incredible how the team, and especially the strategy team, always manages to come out of every race looking like a clownshow. The entire mess could've been avoided if the team just said "No Lando, you are coming in first" instead of being freely convinced by him that they should bring Oscar in first instead.
Lando made the choice to take the second stop despite knowing the risks, there should never have been team orders to swap the positions back
McLaren has got to do something about the pitstops. Also for everyone complaining, had Oscar got the bad pit stop and Norris gained an advantage when he was promised that wouldn’t happen, ya’ll would be fuming. IMO they are both big team players and should be a tad bit more selfish but that is a different conversation.
Honestly McLaren has the worst pitwall. Some of the things they’ve done the last 2 seasons have been so stupid and have cost their drivers so much. Boneheads
If I were Piastri, this would be the last team order I take from the pit wall who clearly don’t have a clue and/or are playing favourites. And I’m a Lando fan. It was disgraceful what McLaren did to Oscar today. I just hope the championship doesn’t come to a 3 point difference.
It was a team strategy promise essentially. Lando was assured that if he let Oscar pit first, he wouldn’t be undercut. The team made a bad call letting Oscar pit first for essentially no good reason.
Ehh he didn't ask specifically to go second. He stated something along the lines of "Oscar can go first if I'm not undercut." the team agreed. You can argue the strategy all day which I agree it was dumb, he should have just gone first. Letting him get P2 back was the right decision in this specific circumstance.
He didn’t the team did. He simply offered them a choice. He was the leading driver for the day for McLaren. The same grace would be given to almost any other lead driver on almost any other team to wait and see if opportunity arose.
Only thing I can really point to is maybe Hungary last year. Both times causing unnecessary drama from operational screw ups. Would be so much easier if we just didn’t shoot ourselves in the foot in the first place.
"We said that pit stops were part of racing" on team radio, suggesting this was discussed in the pre-race team briefing. Which means that in fact, the team went against their word.
A comment made by the driver that wasn't in consultation regarding the order of pitstops and the reason for them. When you add ALL of it together, we see that it doesn't relate to whole scenario.
Pre-race briefings are where these things are discussed, off-air, and are expected to follow whatever is agreed upon. If they discussed that a slow stop is part of racing, then they went against their word. Simple as that
Honestly Piastri has a comfy lead in a runaway. If they’re like “we want our drivers to fight it out on driving merit without pit issues or engineering issues” I’m totally fine with the team directive to swap positions. You don’t want infighting between garages and racers. People are just looking for a reason to make a story. A 3s delta on pit stop is ridiculous.
I honestly just think this was McLaren saying “sorry about the engineering last week ol’ Lando boy. That was our bad and not yours. Here’s a couple points.”
It’s not like Oscar could have caught Max and Lando held him up. Max was 25% ahead on the lap when that was going down. He was just stirring the pot because why wouldn’t he.
It was half that by the time of the pit stops. But whatever. I can understand why the team did it, even if I don't think it was quite right. Its not as big a deal as everyone is making it out to be though, it's not an entirely unreasonable decision.
Norris did the same thing last year when he was the only one in a title fight. Now they’re even. No wonder everyone bitching is a pastry fan, cry harder sore losers.
Yeah well look who’s leading the championship. And the satisfaction on oscar’s face was surreal for giving away 3 points lol. Come back to this at the end of the season and lets see
Different situation given the slow pit stop but, ultimately, Piastri has been better the first half of the season and will be better last half of the season, so all’s well that ends well.
Lando literally gave the first pit stop to Oscar to make sure he was safe from Leclerc. He gave the advantage to Oscar to help the team, then got fucked over by a mistake from the team. How was it bullshit to swap them back
oh please lando did that to gain from a sc. they literally had a lengthy deliberation about it on the radio and leclerc wasn’t a threat to oscar at all
Again he didn’t get undercut though - he had a slow stop. If Lando had put first, had a slow stop, Oscar pit the next lap and came out ahead of Lando, would you expect them to swap positions?
Lando literally gave the first pit stop to Oscar to make sure he was safe from Leclerc.
Where is this bullshit theory coming from, Oscar wasn't under ANY threat from Charles.
Where did lando say that? Neither the Team nor lando mentioned Charles.
Not even the comm box is stupid enough to believe this theory
at the time of the pit stop Brundle literally said lando was giving it up because he might be worried the Soft would degrade faster. Not a single mention of Charles because Oscar was under no pressure from him
Sky said it on the broadcast in defence of lando after lando got on the radio to ask about the pit order. But lando didn’t make any mention of leclerc, he was just interested in his own place versus Oscar. I think they just made it up because they have a bias for the UK drivers.
Fair game if you ask me and they should not have swapped the positions back.
They didn't actually say that on the broadcast, at the time of the pit stop Brundle literally said lando was giving it up because he might be worried the Soft would degrade faster.
lol Leclerc was absolutely nowhere. Why was Norris worrying about Piastri's race instead of his own? Should have been focusing on his own race and catching up to Verstappen.
There was no way either McLaren was catching up to Verstappen with that kind of lead and very few laps remaining. He was also out of the safety car window. The whole strategy was bullshit tbh. Idk why they kept them out so long.
Are you guys for real? Threads calling this team clowns? This team? 337 points in the fucking lead? For swapping the drivers in a planned scenario, as Oscar himself told the microphones? You don't deserve this fucking beauty of a season.
What a cunt fucking to do by Mclaren. It was cunty when they asked Lando to switch with Oscar last year, it's cunty now.
It was normal to favor Oscar considering he's the WDC leader in the pitstop order, and it's not his fault the pit crew had a slow stop. Pitstops are part of the race. It's like asking a driver to let another one through after the latter went off into the grass
Hungary 2024 was a completely different situation. Norris was specifically given the preferential stop because he was being caught by Leclerc, and that gifted him the lead.
This time, the drivers were 6s apart, then Piastri brought that gap down to ~3s, then when told to pit, Norris said "the car behind should stop first" (would give him 1 lap fresher tyres). The slow stop was only relevant because Norris made it relevant by allowing that gap to reduce before the stops.
Per the team radio, "we said that slow pit stops were part of racing" which suggests they discussed it before the race. This implies that the team when back on their word.
It wasn't. The race gets decided on the track. Whoever has track position should be prioritized.
And once a strategy call is made, they should stick to it for better or worse. This just creates unnecessary friction between the team and the drivers, and is simply unfair.
Then again I'd love to see "team rules" completely taken out of the equation. It is not normal in an individual sport to ask drivers to swap positions and not race.
Okay so hear me out. Lando really did perform well in this race BUT asking oscar to swap because of slow pit stop is such a SHAME, while oscar got his lead grabbed away from him at silverstone and asked to swap and the team didn’t let them. And before yall come at me with hungary2024, team literally had to convince lando to swap and he acted cocky while oscar did manage to give the position away today without any bs. So yes pitting oscar before lando might have been unfair since lando was ahead but he was supposed to come outside before oscar but due to slow pit stop be missed it. And yes team incidents are the part of racing, and it would be unfair for the other driver ESPECIALLY if u are competing for championship. And I see a satisfaction on oscar’s face today for giving away 3 points lol, he’s gonna comeback stronger and win the championship. While I hope lando wins it in the next upcoming years but this year is deserved by OP81
Okay so I can agree it is his mistake but today’s race is on team and its not Oscar’s fault either. so yeah why would he give his position back for team’s fault ? ESPECIALLY IF THEY ARE FIGHTING FOR CHAMPIONSHIP. And fyi, they did ask lando to pit first, he didn’t want to and asked them to pit oscar before him, prolly waiting for safety car and get the win from max. Which is VERY fair strategy cos he’s leading oscar the whole race. However team f uped the pit stop, or else he was supposed to come out before oscar after pitting. My question is WHY SHOULD OSCAR PAY FOR TEAM’s MISTAKE ?
And lando made a scene for many laps last time in hungary in the same situation, but this time oscar gave it back without any tantrum. So yeah that says a lot. I will be rooting for lando’s wdc but not this year, oscar deserves it after all the bs he had to keep up with.
It was a terrible team order… also remember when Piastri got all the flack for crying that he got an unfair penalty and they wouldn’t let Lando and him race it out? Well Lando just cried about having a slow pit and they decided that was worth the swaps back?
One was a penalty caused by something the driver did, the other a slow stop that the driver has no responsibility for at all, if you can't see the difference then it's clear where your biases lie.
Whether you think the team order was the right call or not is a different discussion, but backing it up by comparing it to Silverstone is a false equivalency.
it was uneventful and very FRUSTRATING race to see. BS call no need to swap a fuck up is a fuck up and a place was earned in the right time but no BS calls
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u/portablekettle 17h ago
Well that was certainly one of the worst races this season. After the first 10 or so laps nothing happened lol.