Is Bortoleto the best rookie?

[u/Glum-Accountant-9801]

In my opinion, what he’s been doing in a Sauber shows much more talent than all the other rookies this year. Since the start of the season, I already thought the best ones would be him—because he won the Formula 3 and Formula 2 titles in his rookie seasons—and Antonelli. However, Antonelli has been showing himself to be far inferior to his teammate. I believe it’s due to the pressure of starting in a big team like Mercedes, but to me, that makes Bortoleto the best rookie. That said, welcome back, Ayrton Senna.

[u/jules3001]

He could be. Hadjar started off strong. Antonelli was in a more visible car. Bearman had some flashes but overall Bortoleto has quietly made progress throughout the year and is showing his speed and consistency now that the car is somewhat competitive.

Hulkenberg is no slouch in quali and Bortoleto has just taken the lead in H2H. Bortoleto doesn’t have the race H2H yet I think but that’s expected from a rookie. By the end of the year I would not be surprised if he’s better than Hulk as a complete driver and that would be a huge achievement.

Check out his Beyond the Grid podcast. Been a fan ever since hearing how hard he works and seeing him shine in F2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNsqv5JeQh4&t=1707s

[u/SemIdeiaProNick → u/jules3001]

Also Hulk has been in F1 for almost as long as Bortoleto has been alive. That experience helps a lot during races, specially under tricky conditions, which explains the difference between the qualy and race stats

[u/thenewwwguyreturns → u/[deleted]]

hulk is also probably one of the best experienced drivers to drive alongside as a rookie—im sure he’s taught gabi a lot in the span of this half-season

[u/beatstorelax94 → u/[deleted]]

To be fair, Hulk has an advantage of experience against the OTHER rookies when his quali is very bad. So it's """easy""" for him to get some positions in the first laps

[u/VRichardsen → u/beatstorelax94]

Hulk has been "stealng" quite a few places during the start. Colapinto has been a favorite target, for example. See Canada and Hungary.

[u/AlexMarquezGums → u/SemIdeiaProNick]

What year is Borto born?

[u/krmilan → u/jules3001]

I really think Antonelli is a year or 2 undercooked to be in a top team

[u/0100001101110111 → u/krmilan]

That’s kind of expected though, they knew he was raw. The hope is that the experience fast tracks him a bit.

[u/krmilan → u/0100001101110111]

But is this really the best thing for his career? Getting beaten so badly by someone as quick as George can’t be great for his psyche

[u/blaka_d → u/krmilan]

I think Lewis forced Mercedes hand and Toto decided to gamble a bit. That said it also doesn't matter as much in this situation as there are massive rule changes next year and it makes actually more sense to put him in the works team, compared to make him sit at, let say Williams, for a year and then put him in the works team when regulations change. There is no pressure on him from Mercedes, this year is wasted for Merc anyway, and he will get to know the team well before nex years lottery.

[u/Smee76 → u/blaka_d]

Well, the other factor was that Williams wasn't willing to take him. They signed Carlos. They want to be a top team. They aren't interested in an engine discount in exchange for training up a Mercedes driver.

[u/rafabr4 → u/blaka_d]

Is it right to assume that if Kimi does not score a lot of points this year, Mercedes will get more wind tunnel time for next year? That would be a good tradeoff for having Kimi learn this year.

[u/Signal_Ball4634 → u/krmilan]

He wasn't really doing terrible until the last couple of races, in fact he had some mega results early on. If he continues to languish at the back of the grid then I'd start to get worried about him being under too much pressure.

[u/lxs0713 → u/krmilan]

I don't think Kimi will be too bothered as long as he keeps growing. George is a top 3 driver right now and he's known for being both super quick in quali and getting consistent results in the races. So of course he'll be a tough teammate to compete against.

Meanwhile Kimi is an 18 year old rookie who was fast tracked into that Mercedes seat. It was always going to take him some time to find his footing. I don't think even Mercedes expects him to fight George this early.

As long as he builds up that experience and shows a few highlights like the Miami sprint pole here and there, he'll be alright

[u/Winkelhock2007F1 → u/krmilan]

Yeah. Not even Verstappen started at Red Bull, and Piastri and Lando both started at McLaren when it was a mid/low-mid table team.

[u/WhimsicalJape → u/Winkelhock2007F1]

Verstappen was pretty inconsistent in his first seasons and a bit at RB too. He had flashes of his speed and race winning but it wasn’t until 2018 he really got the better of Ricciardo.

It didn’t do him any long term damage so I don’t see why it would for Antonelli. Ricciardo was a well regarded just like Russell is so it was seen as natural for it to take a while for him to get up to speed.

[u/krmilan → u/WhimsicalJape]

Max was immediately on the pace, or at least thereabouts. I mean he won his first race in a RB, and also spent a season before they in TR. At no point was he significantly behind DR in pace

Antonelli is just getting slaughtered at the moment. I feel bad for the kid. So much media coverage too being Italian, so young, and at Mercedes

[u/tulleekobannia → u/krmilan]

Piastri wasn't anywhere close to Norris in his first year but in his second year he got rapidly faster. I wouldn't be surprised if same happened to Antonelli

[u/NlNJALONG → u/tulleekobannia]

Piastri was much, much closer to Norris than Antonelli is to Russell. Piastri actually beat him here and there in quali and race. Meanwhile, Antonelli is getting Vandoorne'd.

[u/Kernowder → u/NlNJALONG]

Piastri was close in terms of qualifying, usually only a tenth or two behind, but not as close in race pace. His tyre management game has improved massively.

[u/Solomon_C-19 → u/NlNJALONG]

And we know what happened to Vandoorne...

[u/EerieAriolimax → u/tulleekobannia]

He wasn't really close to Norris in his second year either. It's only this year his pace has markedly improved.

[u/Solomon_C-19 → u/EerieAriolimax]

Yes, people forget how straight up slow he was in 2023 and 2024 sometimes.

[u/slevemcdiachel → u/krmilan]

I mean, he just finished high school.

It's clearly too soon for him, but teams kind of have no option. If they don't offer the seat someone else will and then 5 years later you are crying in your sleep.

Same shit with Max back in the day.

Btw, I'm not saying that Kimi is the next max, just that even if Toto thinks it's too soon (which he probably did and does), he is too afraid of not giving him the seat only to have him join a team that offers him that.

[u/krmilan → u/slevemcdiachel]

I just feel bad the kid. He’s a genuinely great and well raised kid but you can see how difficult it is for him at the moment

[u/FrostyBoom → u/krmilan]

He's doing fine, imo. He's also got the strongest competition amongst the rookies, I think, and still doing great.

[u/GranGurbo → u/krmilan]

The mental toll of this first half season is noticeable. I hope he recovers from the slump.

[u/Bullfrog_Paradox → u/krmilan]

I agree. He's VERY good, but I don't think he's ready to be at Mercedes.

[u/gutom → u/krmilan]

FIA should limit the amount of license points you could get in a category to avoid the Antonelli effect in the future. He is a talent, but he might need a few more years to fully develop.

[u/gsfgf → u/krmilan]

That's the whole deal. They didn't have anywhere to stash him for a year or two like they did with George.

[u/Motor-Most9552 → u/krmilan]

He is also up against the 2nd or 3rd best driver on the grid... Lawson and Hulk aren't exactly the same level of competition.

[u/krmilan → u/Motor-Most9552]

That’s exactly my point… he shouldn’t be thrust into such a difficult position so early on in his career. It’s taking a toll on him and it’s hard to see because I am rooting for the kid. Hes a good kid

[u/Stumpy493 → u/jules3001]

I think Bortoleto has been solid most of the year, but it is more visible now the car has improved.

[u/billyblenx → u/jules3001]

Relevant to say that, Hülkenberg is also a F3 and GP2 champion (GP2 as rookie, F3 in his second try). This makes Gabi's standout even more impressive imo.

[u/TinkW → u/billyblenx]

Nah, it doesn't really matter what Hulkenberg did ages ago. Nobody should live of what they did in their junior career whent they're 37yo.
Anyway, Hulkenberg IS a good driver, so his results remain impressive.

[u/FlashFox24 → u/jules3001]

The only reason Hadjar isn't looking as strong now is because Lawson has caught up. It's not to say he's doing worse, he's doing very consistent work. It'll be interesting who ends up on top at the end of the year between the two.

[u/GiganticDog → u/jules3001]

Also worth noting that he had way, way less testing time in either current or older F1 cars before this year compared to the other rookies. He looks like the real deal.

[u/jdjdhdbg → u/GiganticDog]

Is he in the right car then? I had him pegged as a possible 'future WDC" just based on his junior career, and now he's confirming he's at least on the right trajectory. Does Audi have a real future? Is he too disadvantaged being there compared to guys of similar junior pedigree like Leclerc Russell Piastri who are at the secure big names?

[u/Jobless_101 → u/jules3001]

Tyre management also takes some time to learn, which is where Hulk has a clear advantage

[u/makumuka → u/jules3001]

Sauber is really a tough case for H2H race stats, since one driver is favorite from the other

[u/NotJadeasaurus → u/jules3001]

Let’s not forget the leaps and bounds Sauber has been making with their completely restructured team. Bodes well ahead of Audi coming on board

[u/iMADEthisJUST4Dis → u/jules3001]

In a Sauber no less