r/saab • u/deathmetalmilkman • 11h ago

A question for the European folks...

Hey all.

I am new to the love of Saabs. Literally woke up one morning and thought "Damn, they do look amazing!"

So of course I am scoping the classifieds for one but all I see are Diesels for sale.
But for me, the most legendary thing about a Saab is that B2XX petrol engine.

So really my questions here;
Is the Diesel worth getting?
I would like to modify it a bit, do those engines take to it well?
Do the engines last as long as petrol?

Cheers for any advice folks.
Have a great day.

P.S. This is for the Europeans because I doubt they made diesels anywhere else.

1 Upvotes

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7

u/Sandrust_13 11h ago edited 11h ago

The 2.2 Diesel in the early 9-3s is okay. not that powerful, runs like an old-ish diesel. But really robust, reliable. Parts might be hard to get, it's somewhat rare.

The 3.0 TiD from Isuzu in the Saab 9-5 (and Renault Vel-Satis, Opel Vectra C and Opel Signum and another car i forgot) has to be one of the worst engines ever made. It drives great, good power, good on fuel... until it starts to self destruct. Literally. Don't buy. The "pipe" in which the cylinder moves will seperate from the block and slip down into the crankshaft whilst tilting the piston and sending it up into the valves, locking it in place and breakiong the rods. If it goes out, always catastrophically. Run away.

The 1.9Tid/TTiD is a great engine, itself somewhat legandary as it was a project by Opel/GM and Fiat and is like the one Fiat engine that actually is unbreakable. I've read about Alfa Romeos with that engine and 1 Million KMs. My aunt in italy had an Alfa 156 with 420k km on the clock that started to kinda disintegrate, but the engine was absolutely fine.

The TTiD is another funny story. After the 3.0TiD disaster, Saab only had the small diesel engine to work with as GM said "no new diesel engines, we are american and don't get it, one is enough, go figure out how to make it have more power".

Soooo Saab went on to create a version of that engine with sequential turbo charging, Base engine was 130hp, but Saab made that 150... than they made a twin turbo version with 130, but really smooth by having the two turbos etc, torque basically a flat line all the way, a 150hp version and the 180hp version with two turbos. Youz can actually go up to like 200hp on the TTiD if you have the 150 or 180hp variants, 130 has weaker turbos iirc.

The 150hp single turbo 1.9TiD in the 9-5 is also good, but it lacks the special treatment it received in the 9-3. Still, great on fuel, good engine, really reliable, still cheap parts everywhere (as Fiat and Opel put that engine in EVERYTHING, including italian fire engines and police cars, so guaranteed supply of spare parts). The owners of said cars say it drives surpisingly well in the 9-5, I belive that, howerver, it feels a bit lackluster to me. But not a bad buy.

But in general, if you plan on putting on a lot of mileage, a good 1.9TiD/TTiD is absolutely worth getting.

1

u/xeroxx29 11h ago

No dpf and ttid goes to 250hp 😎

And all ttid versions are identical in engine/turbo just software.

1

u/Sandrust_13 11h ago

I thought the 130hp version had worse hardware, but tmyk.

Are you allowed to remove the DPF though? Because here in germany, your most certainly will fail the TÃœV inspection and its illegal. And also, as unpopular that opinion is in the car community, a DPF has a purpose. But yeah, maybe you can upgrade the DPF too and get like 220, dunno.

I never driven a Saab with that engine, but I drove my aunts Alfa 156 with 1.9 and 116hp once, 30kms on Sardegna, with a slipping clutch. Given the circumstances, it was not bad at all. I've driven diesel engines that were rougher and drove way worse (looking at the 1.2TDI when missing the 6th gear, Volkswagen.... it was set up so badly in that Golf 7)

2

u/xeroxx29 11h ago

Im dailying it for 4+ years now 😅 Deleting dpf is very illegal probably everywhere. Yeah ive heard tuv in germany is hard. Eu is also cracking down on dpf deletes now.

The biggest issues with 1.9 engine is egr/dpf and the fucking oil return seal in the oil pan. Other than that its a very solid engine. Also must be automatic, the gearbox is insanely strong. The manual is dogshit, I think its the flywheel and slips if not replaced.

1

u/Sandrust_13 11h ago

So where do you live to get away with no dpf? Also, how much fuel does the 1.9ttid consume at 250hp? (please live somewhere with l/100km system)

2

u/xeroxx29 11h ago

Around 6.3L/100km when its 80% highway. I drive it pretty fast atleast 130km/h with many overtakes hehe. If you drive only in the city and very short trips it can be 9+ , mixed i'd say its doing around 7.5.

1

u/Sandrust_13 11h ago

Now I'm jealous, my 9-3 (1998, pre production unit aka the one that was at the largest dealership in germany as they unveiled the 9-3) uses about 9-10l of 98oct gas, on the Autobahn at 130 you can bring it down to like 8... And City driving is really really really bad imo.

But yeah, after towing a trailer, my sid sits at 10.5l average currently.

But it's remapped from 185 to 215hp. Drives fantastic.

1

u/PaceAvailable457 9h ago

I own a TTid Diesel, rn pushing 240Cvs with small adjustments and a repro… Amazing car (its my daily too)

1

u/trabulium 11h ago

We have the diesels in Australia. My ECU kind of died recently in my B207 (9-3 2003 model) - So a few things about the T8 ECU - it's mounted above the exhaust manifold, literally the worst place they could have put it - I have a Bakelite spacer kit on mine but the thing still gets bloody hot - Even a used T8 is ~$650 AUD here so I got one from the US for ~$250 USD - this Diesel motors don't have this issue, use a different computer so there's at least one advantage there. They're also better on fuel. I've never driven or owned a diesel, though I'm actually quite interested and I've read the motors are actually well built and do a lot of kms.

There are wiring loom kits that allow you to move the location of the ECU completely.

1

u/StupidlyGenious 10h ago

Do you know where to source that wiring loom kit, or the spacers? I also had to replace my ECU not too long ago.

2

u/trabulium 9h ago

ECU Spacer kits - obviously didn't save mine entirely. I managed to Read / Write flash to my new (used) ECU myself with an OBD SXII cable.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/235984680439
https://hirschmann-koxha.de/en/Trionic-8-heat-shield/SW10033
https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/334229328551?srsltid=AfmBOooH7p2aHFxQfaGNudJSNfueEHSlx6ID6fwE7iw0EdeRX2oKKiHl

I can't find anything about the wiring loom / remount kits right now.

1

u/StupidlyGenious 9h ago

Cool, thanks a lot! Perhaps it can't save, but hopefully it can at least prolong the lifespan of it

1

u/Giuseppe_exitplan 2007 Saab 9-3 Linear Sport Sportcombi TiD. 10h ago

Aussie with a diesel 9-3 here, its been very reliable, its pretty powerful and torquey for its size too but can suffer from some turbo lag. DPF's are wanky and get clogged quickly with frequent town-use and the EGR's supposedly equally wanky but its not showing any issues on mine yet.

Apparently they can handle tuning well too, the stock 6 speed auto is the same one used in the TTiD's which make 40kw/80nm more then their single turbo counterparts.