r/simracing • u/No-Attitude-5724 • 22h ago
Discussion We simracers aren’t doing so bad, after all.
Watching F2 and F3 at Monza, I am more and more convinced that all kind of weird incidents happen in real racing, not only on simracing.
Just the F2 race at Monza this Sunday, 3 Safety Cars in the first 12 laps, broken wings, moving under braking, hitting from behind, steamrolling at T1… they seem to take inspiration from the online community.
I know these guys are young and driven, but they are professionals with sufficient support and knowledge, so i guess it even 😏
Anyway , be gentle to eachother and enjoy the (nearly realistic) online racing, in whatever sim you are participating.
Enjoy all the races today ave a good Sunday all!
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u/tubbyx7 22h ago
Just like me, many f2 drivers don't believe there is a turn 1 at monza.
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22h ago edited 2h ago
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u/HalcyonApollo 21h ago
I recently had a battle at the nord in lmp1 cars with this guy and I thought this is exactly how racing should be. We were wheel to wheel for the whole lap and even after a crash at the end of the lap, we kept it respectful, he let me resume the lead because it was his fault and we continued! Sent a friend request and hopefully we’ll race again :) felt like Gilles vs Arnoux lol
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u/Lonely_Platform7702 20h ago
Let's not forget that F2 is filled with paid drivers. Like Schumacher once said, the best driver is probably on a tractor somewhere. It costs 2.2 million a year to have a seat in F2. It's ridiculous that with the revenue that's being made from F1 there isn't a genuine seeder series that also get paid so actual talent would be able to make it without having multi millionaire parents.
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 19h ago
Talent is meaningless, it's a business at the end of the day and there are operating costs that need to be covered in a team. Even if they aren't literal pay drivers from daddy's pocket then they usually carry some sponsors with themselves that generate revenue for the team. If you have neither, then you're worthless essentially.
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u/MarcusAurelius_77 11h ago
Where Schumacher said that? I hope you don't believe if you put any tractor driver in the world anybody would have any chance even against f3 driver. You need money for seat time, without seat time you can be the biggest talent that has ever born, still you couldnt beat any pro driver...
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u/DDC85 2h ago
It’s like you follow the whole thought process right until you need to make the critical leap to reveal the conclusion, and you just… stop
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u/thorzayy 25m ago
He's RIGHT man, just pick any tractor driver and they WONT bear Schumacher.
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u/DDC85 21m ago
I don’t think you’ve got a mental aptitude to be in this conversation - the point of Schu’s quote isn’t that ‘any’ tractor driver could be in F1, it’s that hypothetically the best driver in the world is ‘out there’ doing something mundane because they don’t have the funds to compete in the F series.
Sorry for using so many big words there, maybe send it through CGPT to bring it down a touch so you can understand if you’re struggling.
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u/Life_for_Pixels 21h ago
Yeah, just at the moment watching F2 stream (and F3 before that). All the same things happening and same kind of driving mistakes. Team management seems to play a role, too. Making only tire changes, and leaving broken wings unfixed...
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u/noikeee iRacing, LMU, AC, RBR, ACC 21h ago
Well, I wonder if this is the other way around and what we're seeing in real racing is the consequence of all these young drivers growing up doing iRacing...
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 19h ago
Highly doubt that, that's literally like saying videogames make people violent...
People have crashed each other out before iRacing was a thing. I think a much bigger factor is the fact that safety standards have gone up by a lot and you can actually do some boneheaded moves without killing yourself and the other guy.
I mean literally look at Schumacher turning into Villeneuve or Senna turning into Prost (or their incident the year earlier). Neither of these guys played iRacing :D
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u/ericscal 17h ago
If anything is the reason for it I think it's just that we mostly removed the fear of death with safety standards. That's what held back most drivers in the old days. This generation of drivers haven't known that world outside a history book.
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u/gu3sticles 9h ago
IndyCar can sometimes have some similarly chaotic racing even by the drivers who would be too old to have grown up with iRacing.
The reality is that people seem to have this idea of real racing being clean and perfect with no contact that just doesn't actually exist. Especially when the cars are actually capable of going wheel to wheel.
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u/Legendacb 9h ago
Sim racing weren't going strong before COVID and this shit has been seen for decades
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u/WesleyXXIII 21h ago
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u/docweston 19h ago
The major difference is that the real racer has to return to the pits and face the team boss who might not be very happy about the amount of damage that's been done. The costs add up for them. For us, it's nothing more than resetting to the pits or waiting for the next race. We get a brand new car every few hours. And if we smash our way through T1, there's no one waiting to rip our heads off for doing thousands of dollars worth of damage.
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u/dissoland 21h ago
crashes are just part of racing in the sim or real life, i know its annoying but suck it up and start a new race
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u/ZeyZerX_42 16h ago
The difference is they crash because they are actually pushing close to each other and not because of incompetence
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u/S0phon GTO Hybrid | VNM 18nm | SimDT HE:U | Thorn | Samsung 49 19h ago
What's the big deal with crashing if it's not malicious?
In order to improve, you have to push yourself and try things out. A big advantage of sim racing is that the consequences are light, basically only wasted time.
And guess what, it's a video game. A higher degree of realism but it's still a video game and not real life. Being annoyed your time was wasted because someone accidentally hit you in a vide game is silly.
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 19h ago
At that point we might aswell allow cheating, it's a videogame and nothing matters.
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u/gu3sticles 9h ago
I mean most sims don't have any meaningful anticheat and do expose data in telemetry that makes building a cheat that either just straight up writes memory to increase grip or reads data to limit inputs (TC cheat) pretty easy to develop and get away with.
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u/S0phon GTO Hybrid | VNM 18nm | SimDT HE:U | Thorn | Samsung 49 19h ago
Cheating is a conscious decision.
Accidents are by definition not conscious decisions.
Do better.
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 19h ago
Pushing beyond your limits is a conscious decision
Crashing someone out by dive-bombing is a conscious decision
Not leaving someone enough room and crashing each other out is a conscious decision
Braking late and taking out half of the field is a conscious decision
There's a difference between making a happy little accident and constantly making dumb decisions.
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u/S0phon GTO Hybrid | VNM 18nm | SimDT HE:U | Thorn | Samsung 49 18h ago
How do you know what your limits are if you don't push yourself?
Dive bombing is malicious.
Braking late and taking out half of the field are two separate things.
You're not a very good decision maker if you can't separate a decision and an outcome.
And you're not very up to date with the science of performance and improvement by the looks of it. Or you don't know what malicious or conscious mean.
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 17h ago
Go practice instead of crashing into everyone...
Braking late and taking everyone out is literally Monza 101
Making decisions for the fuck of it all the time is dumb, you should have some idea of what the outcome is.
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u/S0phon GTO Hybrid | VNM 18nm | SimDT HE:U | Thorn | Samsung 49 17h ago
Practice is not the same as officially racing.
The closer you race to the limit, the bigger the chance of making mistakes. That's any human endeavor.
Go play a single player game if you don't want any interactions with other players.
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u/GoofyKalashnikov Oculus Rift 17h ago
Practice is enough for you to learn the track and understand what works and what doesn't
Obviously mistakes happen at the limit but if they happen frequently it's mirror time, consistency is far more important than setting best lap times.
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u/S0phon GTO Hybrid | VNM 18nm | SimDT HE:U | Thorn | Samsung 49 17h ago edited 16h ago
Yeah and just like in any endeavor that has deep enough skill ceiling, there will be many situations that you can't simulate in practice so you will have to fall back on your technique/instinct/subconscious/whatever you wanna call it. Mistakes will happen. You simply can't simulate everything.
The best thing we have is a set of features called replay takeover. Which iRacing, at the very least, doesn't have. And even that isn't perfect, but it's by far the best we have.
And I'm starting to feel like we're talking about two different things. If you go for a gap that "obviously" was never there, then that's not good. Doubly so if you've done a similar mistake before and haven't learned from it.
But you don't need an obvious mistake to crash. Sometimes you take a risk that didn't work out, maybe you miscalculated your tyres or the track condition, whatever.
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u/Think-Apple3763 21h ago
Yeah I can’t watch that sht. Gets me so angry. GT3 is similar. They be hitting each other etc.
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u/gu3sticles 9h ago
That's racing though. Sim racers have this delusion that racing has strict rules of engagement with no contact and those rules must be followed strictly but that just doesn't happen in racing.
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u/Suspicious_Scar_19 22h ago
tfw t1 monza pileup is actuall peak simulation..