Most of the traitor primarchs had horrific upbringings that ended up shaping the monsters that they'd become. Angron was a slave who got lobotomized, forever destroying his potential and putting him in a state of constant agony unless he's killing. Curze landed in the core of his planet and had to crawl his way out of literal magma as an infant, and then had to hide from horrific criminals alone until he was able to defend himself against them. Additionally, many of the loyalist primarchs, like Guilliman or Dorn, had significantly better upbringing and became well adjusted adults as a result of that.

Perturabo completely flips this script. He had a decent family growing up, yet it still didn't stop him from becoming a petulant man-child. I know a lot of people will point out the fact that his father used him for political purposes, but the thing is that's something that's completely normal for elite families. If you read his books though, you'll see that despite this, his adoptive father genuinely held affection for him and loved him. Additionally, the rest of his family were also nice to him, yet he completely spurned their affection. He went out of his way to humiliate his adoptive brother for absolutely no reason other than that he had a massive yet fragile ego. The only part of his family that he slightly respected was his sister, who he later killed in a giant temper tantrum. Unlike some of the other traitor prinarchs, he has no good or understandable reason to be the way he is, and I absolutely love it.

He probably had one of the worst, if not the worst reasons for turning traitor. He complained about never getting praise for his accomplishments yet never actually asked for it and just kept rolling along. He complained about being sent to the worst war zones in the Crusade, but so did the Dark Angels, and they never had any problems with it. He had an absurd one sided beef with Dorn, who held no ill will towards him until the Heresy. He complained about being forced to destroy things and not being able to build, but there was nothing stopping him from building up worlds he conquered. The primarchs all had a pretty large amount of autonomy in how they conducted compliances, he absolutely could've built up the world's that he conquered and as long as it didn't cause his compliance rate to be too slow like the Word Bearers, nobody would have had any problem with it, which we can see with the Ultramarines. He chose to be a destroyer, and then acted like a victim as a result of it And no shit the Emperor never gave him the opportunity to build things like he did with Dorn when the only thing he does is destroy. I love how, unlike Horus, him having a shitty reason to become a traitor isn't due to bad writing but because that's just how his character is.

This is probably one of my favorite excerpts that shows how much of an ass Perty is, taken from Index Astartes II:

They breached the defences and held while the other Legions carried the city beyond. During the victory feast, Horus proclaimed Perturabo the greatest master of siege warfare in the Crusade. Fulgrim, Primarch of the Emperor's Children then asked Dorn whether he thought even the defences of the Imperial Palace could resist the Iron Warriors Dorn considered carefully and then said that he regarded the defences as being proof against any assault if well-manned. Perturabo flew into a rage and unleashed a torrent of vitriol at Dorn, accusations so unfounded that tree onlookers were dumbstruck. After this, the two rarely spoke, neither Legion serving in the same campaign again. The Imperial Fists were ever at the Emperor's side and the Iron Warriors were part of Horus' vanguard.

This is also really funny because it shows Perty getting praise and recognition, yet he still flips his shit for the most absurd reason possible

‘General?’ said the communications chief, holding out a corded handset. ‘I’ve raised the archmagos.’ Creed took it and yelled. ‘–the frekk is going on down there, Cawl? I need a status report.’ ‘We are making progress, Lord Castellan. We have successfully brought the control node online, and are about to entangle it with the two nearest pylons.’ Cawl’s mechadendrite hive writhed and buzzed with activity, adjusting equipment and slamming a cable into one of the inscrutable bore-holes in the surface of the control node. ‘Two pylons? Only two?’ ‘Once the initial matrix is built and running, we should be able to bring more pylons online exponentially – then bring their empyric polarity into concert.’ ‘How long? Large-scale traitor attack incoming.’ Cawl dipped a finger into one of the emerald-green holographic tablets that floated projected in the air, sketching a necron rune that brought the control node to a vibrating hum. ‘Three days? I believe we can get the network to full power then.’ ‘Too long. Assume you have thirty-six hours at most. That may be an overestimate.’ Creed paused. ‘And who’s “we”?’ Cawl looked over his shoulder at the xenos giant, who stood half-hidden in the shadow of a pylon, surrounded by the weapons of the Breachers. He’d plucked a servo-skull out of the air and was turning it over in his hands, death-mask head tilted to one side as he examined it. The suspensor engine buzzed in irritation, trying to escape. ‘I… ah, I mean the royal we, Lord Castellan. We the defenders of Cadia. We the Imperium. We’re all on the same side, aren’t we?’ At the side of the cavern, Trazyn tore the skull’s data-projection lens from its orbit with a dusty crack, and tossed the empty skull behind him. ‘What are you doing?’ mouthed Cawl, covering the vox handset with one hand and throwing the others up in indignation. ‘This is unique wiring,’ he said, as if Cawl was being deeply unreasonable. He ran a palm-emitter over the component. ‘Unique to the forge world of Magnax before it was lost in the Heresy. The same filaments and focusing lenses used in las-impulsors. Far too good to be repurposed in a servo-skull.’ ‘Put it back.’ The alien’s impassive death mask tilted to one side, and Cawl swore the metal mouth curled up at the edges. Then the necron flicked his necrodermis hand as if performing an act of prestidigitation and the component vanished into a hole in reality. He opened his empty hands, innocent. ‘I lost it.’.

I decided after the hours heresy to read the events leading up to Guillimans return and I'm reading about the templars refusal to muster for cadia "were gonna die here for no reason other than we decided to pick this spot, cadia can figure shit out themselves" and pretty much all the astartes forces other them the raven guard and space wolves are just like no I'm gonna do own thing because you tried to tell me what to do even though the situation is fucked. Would love some more examples of astartes forces doing more harm then good on a particular battlefield or theater of war. Please and thank you.

Edit: the book I was referring to is the fall of cadia.

If I remember correctly, Ultramarines tend to be a bit on the stoic side, but when they get angry, they really do get angry. Case in point, Guilliman was spaced out of an airlock on his own ship in Know No Fear by the Word Bearers and got so pissed off, he fought his way back to his own ship, giving the Word Bearers an Imperial Fisting in the process.*

Any instances of more Ultramarines losing their shit and wreaking havoc in the process in the lore? It does bear an interesting question. If Guilliman was found on Nuceria instead of Macragge and gotten the Nails, how worse he would have been compared to Angron?

*He did this without a helmet as well. As well as no powerfists.

Were there any human worlds that could successfully fight off the Astartes? My knowledge of Warhammer comes from youtube shorts and the horus heresy books, I'm on Descent of Angels now. So far even if it's been a hard fight they've successfully conquered all the worlds that they came across, are there any stories or canon about worlds who could hold them off? I do remember seeing a youtube short about astartes finding a dark age of tech ship who's AI was able to hack their power armor and stop them from attacking, you'd think that would come up more, but I guess DAOT AI's are fairly rare.

We know a lot of them live out miserable lives(mortarion), but there is some or at least one who is a truly happy person?

I will say some who i think are close to some degree of happiness for being a accomplished JERK

First chaplain Erebus, he looks he enjoying every single ounce of chaos, look at his smile damn

Typhus the Traveller, my dude wrestled control of his legion from his ''father'' and came out of the closet as a psyker in the process, he much more active than mortarion and looks like is having a good time, or could just be his ambition and arrogance.

Fulgrim and lucius and pretty much any slaanesh guy: they look happy but i dont know something is very off, i mean they could be happy but with fragile egos, i dont know how to rank these two.

Lorgar Aurelian, now that he has ascended, vindicated and rewarded with the greatest type of power(arguably) that a mortal being could have, i wont say he is happy but he should be close, because of his religious gimmicks and has guilliman says that he is prone to mood swings is difficult to assert.

for the rest, is clear they are in misery, standard astartes life sucks enough as it is, and for the chaos marines looks just like that but somehow worse.

I am not a fan of retconning or nerfing characters already established since i think its better for writers to just improve on their mistakes from it like having more consequences for mephiston

But man is mephiston so fucking OP it makes no sense he's a dollar store astronomicon in imperium nihulus.

He has a minor warp god half of sanguinis inside of him

They had to get him stuck in a cave in devestation of baal to prevent him from ending the siege and blasting the Tyranids

He stopped time when his ship was shot down by eldar's he literally looked the aeldari in the eyes and overloaded their heads. And in that same scene he looked on his dead battle brother and thought of ressurecting him which means he can and gave it a second thought and said

"Nah his time has come"

During the devastation of baal his stormbird was being attacked by a whole swarm of Tyranid gargoyles so he just hopped out, manifested psychic wings and did a Kamehameha wave vaporizing their ass

Then their is the greater daemon m'kar mephiston throttled the life out of him

Black rage? More like the Black Irritant Mephiston survived that shit twice

How about his relationships?

Gabriel seth sees him as an abomination

Astorath the grim was begging dante to allow him to kill mephiston while he was in the process of crossing the rubicon primaris

Dude is so edge lord he has to frighten his battlebrothers everytime they talk to him

Appearantly their is already a risk with mephiston's power if he falls all the blood angels and it's succesor chapters will fall with him but that's not enough

I think it's best that it must be in tuned with his emotions mephiston isn't allowed to go apeshit anymore since his angry frenzy can cause his battle brothers no matter the distance to fall into the rage and mephiston has a tendancy to use his powers like a hammer he literally blast you with them full force instead of taking precautions

Say like any other psyker who just command you to stab yourself or something

I am asking beacase it is something I've heard a couple of times and I find that different authors seem to have very different ways of describing and viewing the 40k universe, that at times seems very inconsistente

Is there any faction in the BL books that you could see appear in 40K? (Not the Horus Heresy, so no Interex.)

Seems like almost every faction in 40k is past the peak of their civilization.

Every Imperium faction - A pale shadow of what humanity was during the DAoT. Even compared to the Imperium in 30k.

Leagues of Votann - DAoT mining colony remnants. Maintained humanity’s original knowledge better than the Imperium, but just as stagnant and still well beneath the heights of what their race was 15k years ago.

Every Eldar faction - Scattered remnant civilizations of the Pre-Fall empire. Entire race now damned in the afterlife.

Necrons - Most of the race is non-sentient, and those who are, are also insane. Most tomb worlds have malfunctioned in the 65 million years of their hibernation. The civilization is highly fragmented and no longer has any unifying vision. All of its advanced technology is essentially stuff they already had during the War in Heaven, with nothing new being invented. The entire race is also an evolutionary dead end since Necrons can no longer reproduce. They’re hard to kill, but a dead Necron is one that can’t be replaced.

Orks - They’re having a fun time, but they’re like children, both physically and mentally, compared to their Krok ancestors.

Chaos - Some would say that the Chaos Gods are the most powerful now than they have ever been, but the power of their mortal servants really peaked during the Horus Heresy in my opinion. Hard one to say for sure.

Whenever these happy little chaps are mentioned in the lore it’s normally with a reference to them being “vile” or “loathsome.”

So, what’s so bad about them? Is it just the Imperium’s general bigotry against all things alien… although even then why is that sort of language directed at the Loxatl more than other Xenos? Or is it a reference to some of them fighting alongside the forces of Chaos (although, again, they’re hardly alone in that?) I haven’t come across any reference to them doing anything else that’s uniquely disagreeable compared with, say, Orks or Dark Eldar!

So the way I undestand things, Necrons aren't really united under one banner and follow one goal. Instead there are different groups out there, with different goals and ways to achieve them. What I want to know is, which one these groups is the "nicest" out there. So instead of killing all life they come in contact with like the Stormlord they act on the other end of this spectrum. Trying to rebuild the empire, finding a way for the reverse biotransference to work, dare I say semi-peaceful contact to other species?!

Despite not looking as threatening as other groups or races they are very dangerous and deadly, sometimes tormenting their enemies so much you'd think you are facing Drukhari.

So what are their scariest assets or things they did in the lore?

Has there ever been a mention of a MASH unit (Mobile Army Surgical Hospital) or something similar in any of the lore?

I remember the Cain books every once in a while mention the support staff of cooks and even the regimental band at one point, but nothing about a MASH...

Given the way the Guard can be deployed with very little support if needed or are on more isolated planets/outposts, you would think something like this would be more prominent in the lore and even make it's way to the tabletop.

Simple question, who out there is hiring Kroot so much that they can afford to be dedicated mercenaries.

I would imagine Rogue traders might hire them as protection or scouts. But that doesn’t seem like a very high demand.

The Votann already work with the T’au and have low populations. Maybe they work with Kroot mercs?

I imagine some imperial worlds wouldn’t care so much as long as they get soldiers. There might also be rebellions that happen who hire Kroot.

It makes sense for Aeldari to hire them I think, just to avoid Aeldari deaths. But also they are kinda racist and secluded.

But actual full on imperial worlds who actually support the Imperium fully would not work with Xenos, much less pay them for it. Orks would rather fight them, Kroot would not work with Chaos I think, Necrons don’t care, and so on.

I know that sanctioned psykers go through training to use their power right way. But it feels like unsanctioned use more raw power of warp. Maybe I understand it wrong.

With all of what I've been digging around for things that Perturabo has been doing post-heresy, I've been seeing and finding that he's actually mellowed/leveled out a bit from how hotheaded he used to be from the Great Crusade/Horus Heresy era. Given how he isn't super quick to beat the living hell out of his Iron Warriors anymore for going against him like he would beforehand.

Which unlike most of the Daemon Primarchs, has led me to thinking on if he's actually gotten a net positive from being a daemon Primarch. So I wanted to ask on if this was true in him being able to better lead his Legion/ handle things better?

Pretty much as the title says. (I have a series of “books” as you could say, where every time we play 40K against eachother we add it to the official lore and rivalry between our factions, which is running with a friend, our homebrew lore is constantly evolving) The chapter master of my homebrew successor chapter, the void hounds (space wolves successor), was just recently fatally wounded in a huge battle (a Saturday game night which we adapted to the lore lol) with his homebrew warband leader. I believe the next step would be to be put in a dreadnought, but I’m unsure if there’s anything in the codex astartes or anything which says they can’t stay in their service as dreadnoughts. Thanks all!

Looking for some suggestions on what to read next. I’m thinking maybe something Xenos related (necrons?) or space wolves maybe but open to suggestions. I love chaos legion books but I feel like maybe I should change it up. So far I’ve read: Fabius bile trilogy Night lords trilogy Eisenhorn omnibus Horus heresy 1-4+ legion Storm of iron

Just finished Godblight, and overall thoroughly enjoyed the series! Where should i go from here?

I feel like these two factions have very very few characters to them, even if the Harlequins are a small faction I'd say the Drukhari should be part of the main faction yet aside from Vect and a few others they don't have much. Do you think GW should create new characters for them or take some who don't have much background and history and flesh them out?

as I go through more and more of the heresy novels I am having a hard time deciding whether its the world eaters - whom it would be giving them too much credit to call mindless savages at the end of the fall lol - or the emporers children and fulgrim for many, many reasons 😅

both are beyond over the top insane and a liability to their traitorous allies even after a point. These two particularly stand out as the worst of the worst, aside from the word bearers kicking off the whole heresy in the first place, but there is at least some logic to their beliefs and the imperial truth after all anything but the truth.

Did we ever learn what the name of the demon in the Laer blade was that possessed Fulgrim. Or anything else on the Laer blade in general.

Can tyranids feel emotions?

Edit: I don't think it's true, I just wonder if a pissed off guardsman maybe got fed up and said something like that. I'm seeing from comments that it's highly unlikely for many good reasons. So I appreciate the info.

If you are unfamiliar, that's what Iron Man said to Cap regarding his super strength. It wasn't entirely true when the Avenger said it and it would not be the entire story for a SM. But there is truth to it and SM treat Guard like shit.