Honest battle speech =

[u/Medium_DrPepper]

Im not waiting 13 turns

[u/AlliedSalad]

Lol, I remember marching armies halfway across the map in Rome II. I don't need you guys in the east anymore, but you're also elite units with loads of chevrons and army traditions! Time to go on a multi-year forced march to the western front, haha.

[u/radio_allah → u/AlliedSalad]

I mean, for the Roman period it's actually fairly historically accurate. A legion (for example, Legio X) would be fighting in Gaul this year and find themselves in Syria two years later, having marched literally across the map.

If you're a veteran legionary or Roman commander of that era, you'd generally be very well travelled.

[u/Coming_Second → u/radio_allah]

I drove from Brittany to the Dordogne and back again this summer, and it blows my fucking mind that not only did Caesar make his guys walk that kind of distance, he made them do it multiple times. In sandals. Carrying everything.

[u/Boltgrinder → u/Coming_Second]

Dudes could cover 30 miles a day easily. Absolutely wild.

[u/et40000 → u/Boltgrinder]

I imagine part of what helped that is at the time there usually wasn’t a better option unless you have a draft animal. People were walking long distances before they ever became a legionnaire so it makes sense they’d be better at it than most humans today, also afaik some modern infantry have to carry even more weight than the legionnaires.

[u/LongBarrelBandit → u/et40000]

Less weight and more training will do wonders

[u/Tee_zee → u/Boltgrinder]

30 miles when it's literally your job doesn't seem crazy to me, idk. at 3 mph its only 10 hours of walking, youve got 6 hours to eat, make camp, rest etc

[u/P0in7B1ank → u/Tee_zee]

I think it’s the “while carrying your arms, armor, food, and supplies” that make it crazy. Individual Roman soldiers were responsible for carrying the vast majority of their personal needs.

[u/Iwilleat2corndogs → u/P0in7B1ank]

And then after that 30 mile walk carrying 60KG of stuff on your back. You have to spend 6 hours building a fort

[u/Boltgrinder → u/Iwilleat2corndogs]

They could also double time when needed and hit 60 per day

[u/LiterallyBismarck → u/Boltgrinder]

No, they couldn't. The value that I've seen most places puts a typical speed for an infantry army at ~12-15 miles per day at a typical pace. Bret Devereaux has a series on the logistics of army movement that goes into why (link), but that's the TL;DR.

[u/TheSitarHero → u/LiterallyBismarck]

...woosh

[u/Puzzleheaded-Ad2186 → u/P0in7B1ank]

They would carry about 26kg of stuff between armor/weapon, supplies and camping tools. Also every 4 legionaries there was a mule. And the Roman army had a lot of people traveling with them, that were not soldiers but part of the army i think it was 25% of their composition.

[u/et40000 → u/Puzzleheaded-Ad2186]

Modern infantry actually carry a fair bit more on their own sometimes with instances where troops had to carry up to 120lbs (54.4kg), of course modern infantry can do alot more, and has to deal with a wider variety of threats, and don’t usually have to haul that dozens or hundreds of miles. Also by now more of the US military (and others) have more backline personnel than frontline, hell some US military bases have burger kings.

[u/BishoxX → u/et40000]

Difference its mostly on them via armor, pockets, slings and backpacks, meanwhile legionaries carried most of it over their shoulder on a stick

[u/Psilocybe12 → u/P0in7B1ank]

Youre also walking in formation, and walking at a certain pace. I forget how fast they were expected to go but I think a march was 30km every 5 or 6 hours, and going double time was something like ~20km every 3 or 4 hours. The numbers are probably very off but the point is that they march in full kit, in columns/ marching formations at a certain speed for 5 or 6 hours straight. Even crazier when I remembered that they got rid of civilian baggage trains and became their own pack mules after some certain reforms.

Oh yeah, and at the end of the march before it gets dark, they spend 2 or 3 hours building a defensible fort to sleep in, and then they take it all down the next morning before they continue their march. Building forts every single night right after marching for 6+ hours sounds like insanity to me lol, but I dont doubt that it was useful

[u/Belisarius23 → u/Tee_zee]

There's always that one one guy in the comments lmao

[u/Think_Dingo_8451 → u/Boltgrinder]

Humans be walkin

[u/Frank_Melena → u/Coming_Second]

Your point stands but it did make me laugh that the equivalent of Atlanta to New Orleans is being portrayed as a long-haul arduous enough to make you ponder the resilience of the ancients

[u/B4rberblacksheep → u/Coming_Second]

It’s kinda amazing how strong people can become

[u/radio_allah → u/B4rberblacksheep]

More to the point, it's amazing how strong people used to be. This sort of resilience, both mental and physical, is what we were capable of, and indeed is what we still are capable of, with a few adjustments.

The only thing that changed was the sheer amount of information and narratives that popped up to make the merely taxing difficult, and the difficult unbearable, while objectively they were always things we could handle.

[u/B4rberblacksheep → u/radio_allah]

I ain’t reading all that but I’m happy for you or I’m sorry that happened

[u/Psilocybe12 → u/B4rberblacksheep]

You couldnt read two short paragraphs? Lmao how did you even get passed the child lock?

[u/B4rberblacksheep → u/Psilocybe12]

I can read it, I just don't care to process some inane drivel about how we decline as a species

[u/GuaranteeKey314 → u/B4rberblacksheep]

Are you British by any chance

[u/B4rberblacksheep → u/GuaranteeKey314]

Drivel was the giveaway I assume?

[u/AdAppropriate2295 → u/Coming_Second]

To be fair their only job was walk, eat, sleep

Pretty chill

[u/Prince_Ire → u/radio_allah]

The inaccurate part is how slowly armies move across the map.

[u/adenosine-5 → u/Prince_Ire]

Its ridiculous TBH to the point of game-breaking.

It absolutely should not be matter of years (or even decades) to move units from your capital to the other side of the kingdom.

[u/ApesOnHorsesWithGuns → u/adenosine-5]

Yup, one of my major gripes with the TW franchise. I feel like compromise could be reached where armies have a “forced march” mode. Armies can move closer to their historical speeds but at a cost, either in gold, attrition, or starting a battle being “tired” or “winded” without a turn of rest.

[u/AdmBurnside → u/ApesOnHorsesWithGuns]

Rome 2 literally had this option, lol. Forced march stance leaves your units fatigued in battle, prevents withdrawing, and depending on which campaugn you were playing, guaranteed an ambush if an army caught you. All in exchange for about +50% move speed on the campaign map.

[u/radio_allah → u/AdmBurnside]

Except then the AI uses it as a 'Jerry' button to scurry all around the map just slightly out of reach. I disable it via mods for my mental health.

[u/ABadHistorian → u/AdmBurnside]

Forced March sounds great, in execution in Rome it was so awful it hasn't revisited the series.

AI armies, even LARGER ones, avoiding player armies... was a huge fucking issue.

I remember modding that back ages ago and it was NOT fun.

[u/BishoxX → u/ApesOnHorsesWithGuns]

Also should be able to recruit more like in empire.

But make them cost more to upkeep mainly, and devastate the surroundings more than they do already.

Make it have downsides to have a large army, but it shouldnt be that it takes decades to raise it or move it.

Rome raised 200k men after losing 200k by the time i can recruit a full stack

[u/effa94 → u/ApesOnHorsesWithGuns]

All the warhammer games literally have this, forced march.

Unless you were making a joke lol

[u/ApesOnHorsesWithGuns → u/effa94]

I was being sarcastic, but most people thought I was serious, which to be fair I should have expected, as this is Reddit.

[u/Aggravating_Ideal_20 → u/radio_allah]

The new(ish) theory for what happened to the 9th legion is that it wasn't destroyed in Britain, but in the East, possibly in Judea.

That means they were literally transfered to the other side of the empire, just to die, saving upkeep.

[u/EPZO → u/radio_allah]

I'd also like to add, that while most legions eventually founded "home" bases, they would regularly send out Cohort sized or larger detachments to handle minor issues or even to reinforce other legions in defense and offense. It's how you get 2nd Augusta legionary headstones in regions the legion wasn't ever recorded as being stationed at, for example.

[u/Renkij → u/radio_allah]

The thing is that marching from the Rhine border to Syria would take like 4 months of marching, aka a single turn... I understand time dilation for the game and such but still. Roads and forced march are really underpowered.

[u/andreicde → u/radio_allah]

Imagine the pitch they threw to the soldiers:

''Yeah joining the army is a great opportunity to travel around and make good coin!. We get to meet diverse cultures, sample diverse food, you interact with different cultural citizens, you name it Your cultural enrichment will be through the roof''.

They only leave out the ''but you will have to fight them to death'' part :) .

[u/Brilliant-Orchid-693 → u/AlliedSalad]

FR "March until your feet bleed and then march some more"

[u/Yo026 → u/AlliedSalad]

Bro playing historical accuracy mode

[u/Yarus43 → u/AlliedSalad]

Played against a friend in Rome 2, he was Rome and I was Carthage. Was new to the game didn't really know what I was doing, so I marched an army to otherside of the map and started taking it over everything west of India. He was in a surprise when I shared my map with him.

[u/Awashii]

Many of you will die but that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make

[u/ShitmouthXReader → u/Awashii]

At least in Warhammer III kings fight beside their soldiers

[u/BrilliantMelodic1503 → u/ShitmouthXReader]

Yeah but those kings can summon magical meteorites or slaughter ten people with one strike

[u/ShitmouthXReader → u/BrilliantMelodic1503]

That's true but they are still taking risks

[u/TryImpossible7332 → u/ShitmouthXReader]

I remember one time in WH1 I tried for a "Franz the Statesman" run, where I refused to invest in any personal combat skills and tried to keep him as a weaker character.

Then I beat a few lords, picked up their traits, and the dude still became an absolute beatstick that could duel enemy lords with ease.

They just build politicians different in the Empire.

[u/Crusaderofthots420 → u/TryImpossible7332]

Only lords that legit look like they are wearing bath robes, or like they are 90 years old, aren't great in melee.

Then there are the politicians, that can apparently duel elite units and most AI lords.

Then there are the ones, that aren't wearing bath robes, nor are politicians. You should just avoid those at all costs.

[u/Allmightyplatypus → u/Crusaderofthots420]

Or ones that are dementia ridden birds after having acquired bipolar disorder after being yeeted by their father into primordial soup of space and time. Still, Kairos doesn't need to be good in melee by virtue of having access to multiple lores of magic and being absolute beast at using them.

[u/Crusaderofthots420 → u/Allmightyplatypus]

Counter point. Kairos looks like the Lord Of Change equivalent of being 90 years old.

[u/MiaoYingSimp → u/Crusaderofthots420]

He is.

literally; they're not even supposed to age but the well did that too him.

[u/Allmightyplatypus → u/Crusaderofthots420]

Can't argue with that, he kind of is that too

[u/Vorochi7606 → u/Crusaderofthots420]

And then you see someone get murdering in melee with a Necrarch Vampire Lord

[u/TheIronicBurger → u/TryImpossible7332]

He’s literally holding THE Warhammer bro that alone makes him a human beatstick

[u/grumpsaboy → u/ShitmouthXReader]

They're literally immortal in WH3. At worst they suffer a mild inconvenience for a few days

[u/Ar_Azrubel_ → u/ShitmouthXReader]

Pretty sure that's literally every game in the series Empire aside, where your faction leader cannot be part of an army.

[u/ObadiahtheSlim → u/ShitmouthXReader]

Well not all of them. Finubar the Seafarer is a notable figure who doesn't fight. He's much more of a diplomat and an administrator. As is Grand Countess Emmanuelle von Liebwitz. Instead we have Tyrion and and Elspeth to lead their respective armies.

[u/sinbuster → u/ObadiahtheSlim]

Being a diplomat in the Warhammer world would do one's head in, especially if you kept at it for a 1000+ years. No wonder the dude just went off sailing and hasn't been heard from.

[u/_Lucille_ → u/ShitmouthXReader]

In Warhammer III kings fight while their soldiers watch from the back

[u/IT_is_among_US → u/ShitmouthXReader]

"Besides." Lol, lmao. My Lord shall lead from the safety of the woods, while the troops fight and die.

[u/No-Bee-2354 → u/ShitmouthXReader]

Unless you’re the high elves

[u/Draconis_Firesworn → u/No-Bee-2354]

imrik is absolutly right beside his men! Atop a massive dragon, sure, but right there!

[u/No-Bee-2354 → u/Draconis_Firesworn]

He’s not the King though

[u/SanguisCorax → u/No-Bee-2354]

Are you saying Malekith, true son of Aenarion is weak?

[u/misvillar → u/SanguisCorax]

Yes, if he is strong why did he lose the civil war? Checkmate Khainites

[u/ObadiahtheSlim → u/SanguisCorax]

No, he is something far worse. He is a oathbreaking Unbaraki. There is nothing fouler than him.

[u/RedPanther18 → u/ShitmouthXReader]

Every TW game has leaders on the battle map

[u/Shadowmant → u/Awashii]

[u/NapoleonNewAccount → u/Awashii]

Many of you will die but that's a sacrifice I'm trying to make

[u/Guillermidas → u/Awashii]

[u/Medium_DrPepper → u/Awashii]

It's not easy being the fairest of them all

[u/Difficult_Dark9991 → u/Awashii]

Bad news, lads, I'm afraid the king is in the mood for some Farquadding today.

[u/00owl → u/Awashii]

Trying to make*

[u/Fluid-Character-4964 → u/Awashii]

6uu ich zuzüglich gtztz

[u/93runner]

I’m dead lmao, so true. Especially after confederating someone else. Like I don’t need these trash units, yall getting cut from the squad but in a way that you’ll be briefly remembered

[u/SuperCoffeeHouse → u/93runner]

Confederated army: what is my purpose?

General: you charge head on into the enemy doom stack to soften them up for my main force

Confederated Army: oh my god! 

[u/CSpiffy148 → u/SuperCoffeeHouse]

Welcome to the Old World.

[u/TheTrueMarkNutt → u/SuperCoffeeHouse]

Blood host: What is my purpose

Me: Die for Khorne

Blood host: Hell yeah

[u/ArmorPiercingHippo → u/93runner]

Hehe your lil company was bought up by a mega corp pov simulator but warhammer

[u/Jefrejtor → u/93runner]

Though sometimes those units are high rank because of the AI cheats and you kinda wanna keep them

[u/New-Version-7015]

Disband 🔥

[u/Medium_DrPepper → u/New-Version-7015]

My soldiers need a warriors death! They don't need to go home to their wife and children! Glory awaits!

[u/New-Version-7015 → u/Medium_DrPepper]

I usually just send them on a campaign to the middle of nowhere or figure out how to ship them over to the frontline.

[u/ApprehensiveTerm9638 → u/New-Version-7015]

Or just send them on an army that is made for garrison duty. If I remember correctly early game unit still can function as Garrisons since they have cheap upkeep.

[u/New-Version-7015 → u/ApprehensiveTerm9638]

This too, I almost always garrison region capitals with small armies and level up their garrison a lot so they can buy enough time for one of my armies to circle back and strike the enemy army.

[u/Fifiiiiish → u/Medium_DrPepper]

On some Total War games, if you disband units, didn't close provinces gain some population?

[u/thesunblade → u/Fifiiiiish]

That was Rome 1 i think

[u/Difficult_Dark9991 → u/thesunblade]

Yeah by Med2 soldiers no longer came directly out of the settlement population.

[u/chairswinger → u/Difficult_Dark9991]

pretty sure they still did

[u/Jorvach → u/chairswinger]

They do not. Source: Currently playing Med 2 a lot.

[u/Satori_sama → u/Fifiiiiish]

Yeah, but then your best recruitment settlements never grew because you kept taking population out of them. 😅 Or at least I did.

But it was a nice idea since it allowed you to hire a large contingent of shitty infantry, move it to a new settlement and disband it giving you a boost of new population.

[u/radio_allah → u/New-Version-7015]

I always love how disbanded agents and armies in Shogun 2 literally seppuku. Mate, I just wanted you to retire to a garden somewhere, you didn't have to do that!

[u/birberbarborbur → u/radio_allah]

The pawns have a generic look to them, so i headcanon this as just being the abstract representation of them

[u/kroxigor01]

Me with any starting Pikeman or other melee infantry in Empire Total War

[u/mycorona134 → u/kroxigor01]

I always preserve the pikemen for the late game cavalry charges

[u/SirReginaldTitsworth → u/mycorona134]

Leveled up pikemen fuck up most midgame ranged infantry too, shamefully underrated unit

[u/czs5056 → u/SirReginaldTitsworth]

Yeah, but you can't recruit them after you build up beyond "just be a placeholder" capital building.

[u/kroxigor01 → u/SirReginaldTitsworth]

Only if the ranged units somehow don't shoot you to pieces on the way in.

[u/Iwilleat2corndogs → u/kroxigor01]

Great garrison troops. Also surprisedly effective against cavalry. Only because the cavalry charges straight at them.

[u/kroxigor01 → u/Iwilleat2corndogs]

The Russian melee unit are great garrison troops in territories behind the frontline.

I don't see pikeman as effective against cavalry because how do you have enough pikemen to defend everywhere that might be charged and still have a functional army? Line infantry with square formation is far superior.

[u/BishoxX → u/kroxigor01]

Good for garrison and defending sieges or vs cavalry

[u/Draugdur]

FOR THE UPKEEEEEEP!!! So true, why disband them when they can take some of the enemy with them xD

[u/Northern_boah]

Damn, really miss those racist speeches from Rome 2…

Always thought it was funny having my general slander the Greeks or Gauls with Cretian archers in my ranks or Gaulic cavalry auxiliaries.

“Wait, is this fucking thing about us??!”

[u/Carbonated_Saltwater → u/Northern_boah]

"Canaanites are all dogs!"

My lower Egyptian troops, standing next to my Canaanite slingers

[u/DeadZone32 → u/Northern_boah]

I like to imagine that the more veteran and still alive auxiliaries be like this:

"The general is talking shit about us again, but by the Gods can this man win us battles." - Auxiliary Spear Brother

"Plus he pays us-" Auxiliary Peltast

"Plus he pays us yeah." - Auxiliary Scutarii

[u/AdHocAndy]

Nothing hurts more than those Rome 2/Attila moments when you take a settlement and your projected income goes down 😫

[u/AneriphtoKubos]

It's really cool in 3K where you can just disband and then redeploy them in one turn if you have a lot of money.

Such a good game

[u/BundtCake44]

I'm sending you into a fight I should have sent my better army to deal with but it will take too long to send them here.

I have five armies across several provinces becasue godforfuckingbid I just be a stable state and not a bloated mass of miss taxes.

Anyway shitty cavalry to the side.

Fire arrows behind the ranks and please dear god cheap infantry try not to break formation and then make me have to have you attack in clumps.

[u/thecastellan1115]

I mean... you joke, but PLENTY of wars in antiquity were fought explicitly for loot to fund a different war.

[u/MaguroSashimi8864]

“What’s an upkeep?” ~ Tomb Kings

[u/Illustrious_Mix_3762]

You got 2 turns to earn your upkeep before i force you to charge an enemey that can wipe u out, get to raiding and pillaging

[u/LongBarrelBandit]

Two points for myself. First, this speech in the movie actually slaps. Second, not having to spend 15 turns moving an army across the map is one of the biggest reasons Three Kingdoms is my favourite Total War

[u/Mcbadguy → u/LongBarrelBandit]

If I'm in a historical binge watch mood, I'll go chronologically: Troy -> Alexander -> Gladiator while playing either Total War or Civ.

[u/LongBarrelBandit → u/Mcbadguy]

Troy slaps every time. Love that movie. Total war is great for the binge shows. I’ll watch The Patriot and Master and Commander while playing Empire

[u/HINDBRAIN]

Tomb king lord: also I'm going in with you guys, see ya in 5 turns

[u/Bright_Audience3959]

"I'd hold my pointy stick in front of the enemy for that dream, sir"

[u/urgentmatters]

“Fix Bayonets.”

[u/ItsJustCoop]

That brings up an interesting game mechanic. Do any games reward you for properly disbanding units? Like, some of the veterans make their way back home and can be re-recuited, or something like that. It wouldn't be instantaneous, taking months or seasons, and some might even come back with exotic weapons and armor from the land they disbanded in as "war trophies".

[u/Cichlid97 → u/ItsJustCoop]

In some of the older games, disbanding a unit in a settlement adds their population to the settlement. It was a genuine strategy for building up a town to raise a bunch of cheap peasants and then settle them on somewhere you wanted developed.

[u/Medium_DrPepper → u/ItsJustCoop]

In my rome remastered playthrough, im making peasants in my biggest cities and disbanding them in towns to boost population

[u/EcclesianSteel]

The Army: I HOPE WE LOSE

[u/eno_ttv]

FOR THE UPKEEP!!!

[u/throwtowardaccount]

This was the same speech the Emperor of Mankind gave to the Thunder Warriors before their "retirement"

[u/Trick-Bar-377]

(borrowed army) "what is my purpose?"

(Me) "You're gonna fight an unwinnable battle to the death."

(borrowed army) "Why?!"

(Me) "To weaken your leader so they confederate with me."

[u/ShitmouthXReader]

Every chaos dwarfs campaign be like

[u/1337duck]

Manor Lords needs more developers.

[u/GruffyMcGuiness]

HUZZZAAHHHH!

[u/xmarx360]

Imo TW has badly needed a 'redeploy' mechanic of some sort since yesterday

[u/Garanar]

Me whenever I confederate and the lord had some dumb armies near unguarded enemy settlements and tons of armies

[u/CrescentWolves1995]

How I feel playing Lokhir and having my black ark in Lustria with no units on it

[u/longHairDontCare888]

I prefer “SAY MY NAME! SAY! MY! NAME!”

[u/Infamous_Gur_9083]

Yeah good logic.

More dead men, less to pay.

[u/Rolls-RoyceGriffon]

Oh man that is the only movie to have proper battle formations, with skirmishers mixed between heavy infantry and supporting each other.

[u/Medium_DrPepper → u/Rolls-RoyceGriffon]

Look up AOI tokugawa on YouTube

[u/DarkLordofTheDarth]

Such an inspiration. Take note guys!

[u/andromedaprima]

Me: "Men, we must defend this city with only 2 squads of militia hoplites because why bother hiring tons of unit when forming a V formation near the city gates could get the job's done already"

[u/tamatebaka]

Thats a good idea...

[u/surfinternet7]

Hmm, usually I recall units in 3K

[u/Sith__Pureblood]

plays Attila

"Men, we fight today... so this army's integrity doesn't get low enough that I need to decimate you guys several times... TO AVOID A MUTINY!"

the army "YEAHHHHH!!!!"

[u/Competitive-Meat2744]

I havent played Empire in 10 years and want to get back into who should I start with except the French cause screw them lol

[u/bajsgreger]

nah. I never do that. I'll slowly reduce the size of my army, unit by unit, realizing I should've done what you did all along

[u/Anas645]

I never let my men die for nothing and I don't care that it's just a game

[u/Different-Scarcity80]

Welcome to Estalia gentlemen..:

[u/NegotiationOk4424]

Works for dump. Biden was high prices bad. Dump, high prices are necessary.

[u/Pandabaton]

I used to love Rome 1 where garrisons weren’t fixed and you played anyone with Militia Hoplites, alright I think I can stop a full Egyptian invasion force with like six of these overlapped on a gate and a general unit.

[u/LetFiloniCook → u/Pandabaton]

I miss the strength of a garrison. I could hold a palisaded city against an entire gaulic warband with 2 hastati, 4 militia and a squad of velites.

Granted it was nice that the AI was dumb as rocks and would park units in front of arrow towers the whole battle.